From: ham789@netzero.net   
      
   On 5/3/2013 8:16 AM, Morris Dovey wrote:   
   > On 5/2/13 4:47 PM, mike wrote:   
   >   
   >> Would be interesting to see the theory.   
   >   
   > It’s a relatively straightforward Carnot cycle / Stirling / fluidyne   
   > engine. There’s an abundance of educational material on the web in   
   > addition to the specifics I provide in my web pages.   
      
   I don't pretend to understand any of that except that temperature   
   differences and/or pressure differences are required to make it work.   
   And the upper bound of energy output is the energy you put thru it.   
   >   
   >> Sounds like an evening project.   
   >   
   > With temperature above 705˚F and pressure above 3200 PSIA, I’m inclined   
   > to proceed a bit more deliberately.   
      
   Which begs the question, "why pick water with an exceedingly high   
   critical pressure?"   
   Ethanol would reduce your pressures considerably.   
   And helium is supercritical at 2.24 atm at any temperature you'd   
   care to operate it.   
   Should be able to do initial experiments with a helium balloon   
   and copper or aluminum or glass pipe???   
      
   Piping issues are subject to the natural laws that we understand.   
   Should be a simple calculation of what material and how thick.   
   Fill it with salt water, open a port and boil out half, close the port   
   and you should be able to observe the effects of the working fluid   
   sloshing back and forth.  Hook up a FET as an electrometer to see   
   if there's any response when you sense next to a magnet.   
   Keep heating it to the supercritical   
   temperature and observe a dramatic change in efficiency...or not.   
      
   >   
   >> I'm trained as an electrical engineer. I know just enough about physics   
   >> to be dangerous. I don't have the answers, but I do know enough to ask   
   >> questions ;-)   
   >> Here's my concern about that...   
   >> If you have a plasma flow in one direction, the charges are "bent"   
   >> Strike one.   
   >> Strike two?   
   >> Strike three?   
   >   
   > I think you may have confused supercritical water with plasma.   
      
   Yes, I've only done a little research on supercritical water. All of what   
   I have found related to solvent properties.  I found nothing related   
   to free ions.   
      
   Plasma is about ionization.   
   MHD relies on bending ion trajectory in a magnetic field. Yes?   
      
   So, I agree that I am confused how supercritical water relates.   
   >   
   > Keep in mind that MHD is a reversible effect - that a given amount of   
   > power can be applied to an MHD head to move a given mass of water at a   
   > given velocity; and that if that mass of water is moved through that MHD   
   > head at that velocity it will generate that same amount of power.   
      
   Pretty easy to verify.  Turn on the garden hose.  Spray it thru a big   
   magnet. Stick some tinfoil collector plates near the stream.   
   Measure the power.   
   I think I'll convert my house pipe to PEX, put old hard drive   
   magnets on it and harvest the shower-power.   
   >   
   > There are some informative YouTube video demonstrations.   
      
   I've rarely encountered informative YouTube videos on anything   
   controversial.  I've seen lots of hand waiving with pseudo-science   
   applied to make it sound like something wonderful is happening.   
      
   If you have a link to a particular youtube video that expresses   
   the concept with RESULTS...as opposed to handwaiving and pseudo-science,   
   I'd like to see it.   
   >   
   >> simplicity and ease of maintenance will be far in the rear-veiw mirror.   
   >   
   > Never underestimate the power of laziness. :-)   
      
   I'm an expert procrastinator.  Problem is that I never seem to have the   
   time to do it. ;-)   
   >   
   >> If stuff works, it should be easy to demo and reproduce.   
   >   
   > Tokamak? LHC?   
      
   Exactly.  Hasn't Tokamak been reproduced?  Based on sound theory?   
   It's a simple matter of not being able to build one with currently   
   available practical materials.   
   >   
   > I’m guessing you’re unaware that the Ni/H LENR has been verified   
   > independently with different experimental apparatus.   
      
   Musta missed it in all the hype.   
   You'd think it would have been on the front page.   
   If you've got a link, I'd like to hear about a peer reviewed working   
   model with practical/usable amounts of sustained output power.   
      
   >   
   >> I think you'd be better off playing golf with someone in the business   
   >> of funding Rossi and collecting commission. ;-)   
   >   
   > “I believe every human has a finite number of heartbeats. I don’t intend   
   > to waste any of mine.” ...Neil Armstrong   
   >   
   > Me too.   
   >   
   Can't argue with that.  If you're doin' what you love, you're better off   
   than most.   
   But sellin' Rossi shares on commission is an easy hedge.   
   No problem with having both. ;-)   
      
   I'd still like to hear more details about what you're doin'.   
      
   Sounds like you're doin' a lot of stuff at once.  That often leads   
   to frustration.   
   Stuff like free energy and water cars and the like are all about taking   
   a small part of a theory and generalizing it to predict a result that   
   is never achieved, because the theory fell apart with the   
   generalization.  Simple experimental results are nonexistent.   
   You get some hand-waiving with no substance...surrounded by conspiracy   
   theory.   
      
   Stanley Meyers is an urban myth.  I can't believe that anyone with   
   such a monumental achievement wouldn't have told anybody else how to do   
   it.  But there's no shortage of "believers".   
      
   I'm doin' all this naysayin', but it's easy to put me in my place with   
   some simple theoretical/experimental results.  And that's all I'm trying   
   to make visible.  I don't wanna read websites or watch youtubes.   
   I wanna see YOUR analysis/plan/results...with real predicted/measured   
   numbers.   
      
   I'll even volunteer to help.   
      
   I built/instrumented/debunked some HHO stuff for a local water car   
   enthusiast.   
   I was hoping it would channel his considerable creativity away   
   from HHO into something more practical.   
      
   Ok, one more story.   
   The inventor mentioned above took me to visit a local guy   
   with a HHO augmented Honda.  He couldn't answer any basic   
   theoretical questions about anything.   
   His entire case was built on one experiment where he installed   
   a device to tweak his car's ECU.  He filled up his tank,   
   headed down the freeway, tweaked the ECU until the engine   
   stalled, then backed up till it restarted.   
   Drove for 35 miles, filled up at a different station,   
   calculated the MPG.  He put up a website trying to sell the   
   technology.   
      
   He accepted my offer to build a gizmo that instrumented   
   fuel flow in real time so we could actually test it.   
   By the time I got it done a week later, He'd disappeared.   
   Guess he really didn't want to know the facts.   
      
   Most interesting part of the whole process was his story   
   about how he forgot to turn off the hydrogen generator overnight.   
   Next morning, he blew the valve covers off the engine when   
   he tried to start it.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)