XPost: alt.anarchism, alt.politics, alt.politics.socialism   
   XPost: alt.politics.liberalism   
   From: jamesd@echeque.com   
      
   Paul Bramscher   
   > > > Not mine.  I think we need to toss off those who   
   > > > claim monopolies of real estate and natural   
   > > > resources, to restore an open space such that   
   > > > anyone may sustainably collect resources (berries,   
   > > > mushrooms, seed, firewood, meat, fish, etc.),   
   > > > erect a home, squat in a tent, etc.   
      
   James A. Donald:   
   > > Plenty of room to do that now.  No one wants to do   
   > > it.  They prefer to live in cities.  Modern hunter   
   > > gatherers are not only vanishing because farmers   
   > > stole most of their land.  Quite a bit of land   
   > > remains.  They are also vanishing because they   
   > > prefer to hunt and gather from rubbish heaps and   
   > > dumpsters.   
      
   Haines Brown   
   > Could you survive on your own in the wilderness? I may   
   > be a city animal, but I've read enough to know that it   
   > is almost impossible except in the short term, in   
   > reasonably favorable circumstances, and using some   
   > modern equipment.   
      
   The proposal was to restore the primitive commons.  You   
   are just telling me that the primitive commons is no   
   good.  Quite so.  Just what I said.   
      
   In order to have all the nice stuff of modernity, the   
   primitive commons is no good.  Stuff has to be   
   elaborately transformed.  This requires private property   
   and markets - or else the central planning committee,   
   gulags and mass murder.   
      
   --   
     ----------------------   
   We have the right to defend ourselves and our property, because   
   of the kind of animals that we are. True law derives from this   
   right, not from the arbitrary power of the omnipotent state.   
      
   http://www.jim.com/      James A. Donald   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)