XPost: alt.christnet.christianlife, alt.bible, alt.christnet.christnews   
   From: usenet@christrose.news   
      
       • Matthew 3:11–12. John’s prophecy of baptism “with the Holy Spirit   
         and fireâ€� is fulfilled in two distinct ways: the Spirit’s baptism   
         at Pentecost (Acts 2) and judgment by fire (Matthew 3:12). The   
         “fireâ€� here is not zeal or emotional experience; it is destruction.   
         The chaff is burned with unquenchable fire. John contrasts the   
         saved (Spirit-baptized) and the lost (fire-baptized). The verse has   
         nothing to do with ongoing sign gifts.   
      
       • Acts 8, 10, and 19. Each passage records a unique historical   
         transition. In Acts 2, Jews receive the Spirit; in Acts 8,   
         Samaritans do; in Acts 10, Gentiles do; and in Acts 19, disciples   
         of John are brought into the new covenant. Tongues in these moments   
         serve as confirmatory signs that all groups are now one body in   
         Christ (1 Corinthians 12:13). Hebrews 2:3-4 later explains that   
         these signs confirmed the message when it was first proclaimed.   
         They are not repeated instructions for every generation.   
      
       • 1 Corinthians 13:8-10 teaches that tongues “will ceaseâ€� (middle   
         voice). They would stop of themselves. Prophecy and knowledge “will   
         pass awayâ€� (passive voice)—when “the perfectâ€� comes. Nothing in   
   the   
         text requires tongues to continue until Christ returns. Their self-   
         ceasing nature fits the historical evidence: by the time of the   
         later epistles, the gifts had faded.   
      
       • Romans 8. "Robert" uses this passage to claim that the Spirit must   
         quicken believers physically now. But Paul speaks of spiritual   
         life: “the mind set on the Spirit is life and peaceâ€� (Romans 8:6).   
         The “quickenâ€� (zÅ   
   opoieÅ   
   ) of verse 11 looks forward to   
         resurrection—God will raise our mortal bodies in the future. This   
         has nothing to do with ongoing miraculous healings.   
      
       • Hebrews 2:3-4. The verb “was confirmedâ€� (á¼�βεβαιώθη)   
   stands in the   
         aorist passive indicative—an action completed in the past. God has   
         already validated the gospel by signs and wonders. That   
         confirmation need not, and will not, be repeated continually.   
      
       • John 20:30-31. John writes that the recorded signs are sufficient   
         “that you may believe.â€� Scripture itself now bears that confirming   
         witness. To demand new signs is to doubt the sufficiency of God’s   
         Word.   
      
       • Paul’s later letters show the shift: no mention of tongues or   
         miracles in Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, Thessalonians,   
         Timothy, Titus, or Philemon. Instead, the Spirit’s fruit—love, joy,   
         peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness,   
         self-control—becomes the standard evidence of His presence   
         (Galatians 5:22-23).   
      
       • Real biblical healings were instant and total (Matthew 8:3; Acts   
         3:7-8). Modern claims are unverifiable. The difference   
         exposes imitation, not continuation.   
      
       • The true mark of a believer is not tongues or signs but obedience   
         and love: “By this it is evident who are the children of Godâ€� (1   
         John 3:10). John gives doctrinal and moral tests, never charismatic   
         ones.   
      
       • When "Robert" says God “changesâ€� by reviving gifts, he   
         misunderstands God’s immutability. God’s character never   
         changes, but His works progress according to His plan. Just as   
         He ceased creating on the seventh day (Genesis 2:2), He ceased   
         confirming the gospel once it was established (Hebrews 2:3-4).   
         The cessation of signs proves completion, not alteration, of   
         His purpose.   
      
   Thus, every text "Robert" cites either refers to the once-for-all   
   establishment of the gospel or to unique transitional events. None   
   demand ongoing miracles or tongues today. The purpose for   
   signs—confirmation to unbelieving Israel—has been fulfilled, and the   
   gifts have ceased of themselves, exactly as Scripture foretold.   
      
   For 15 convincing Bible evidences the sign gifts like tongues, healings,   
   and miracles ceased, see https://christrose.news/ceased   
      
   --   
   Have you heard the good news Christ died for our sins (†), and God   
   raised Him from the dead?   
      
   That Christ died for our sins shows we're sinners who deserve the death   
   penalty. That God raised Him from the dead shows Christ's death   
   satisfied God's righteous demands against our sin (Romans 3:25; 1 John   
   2:1-2). This means God can now remain just, while forgiving you of your   
   sins, and saving you from eternal damnation.   
      
   On the basis of Christ's death and resurrection for our sins, call on   
   the name of the Lord to save you: "For 'everyone who calls on the name   
   of the Lord will be saved'" (Romans 10:13, ESV).   
      
   https://christrose.news/salvation   
      
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   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)