home bbs files messages ]

Forums before death by AOL, social media and spammers... "We can't have nice things"

   alt.religion.christian      Yet another Christian discussion group      8,774 messages   

[   << oldest   |   < older   |   list   |   newer >   |   newest >>   ]

   Message 8,361 of 8,774   
   Christ Rose to All   
   Re: Christmas Falsehoods By Watchtower:   
   05 Dec 25 07:44:00   
   
   XPost: alt.christnet.christnews, alt.bible   
   From: usenet@christrose.news   
      
   Your entire argument tries to create an escape hatch—a way for a sinner   
   to reject Christ’s glory, deny His deity, and still imagine he will   
   avoid conscious judgment in Gehenna. It promotes a false plan of safety   
   that Scripture never grants. It persuades men that they can refuse the   
   only Savior who died for our sins and rose again (1 Corinthians 15:1–4),   
   and yet somehow escape the God who judges both body and soul after death   
   (Matthew 10:28).   
      
   John’s prologue destroys that false refuge before you ever reach verse 1:18.   
      
   Your claim about Greek grammar collapses the moment you let the entire   
   passage speak.   
      
   John 1:1 does not carve out space for “a god.” John gives you no such   
   category.   
      
   “All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing   
   made that was made” (John 1:3, ESV).   
      
   You insist the Word belongs among created beings. John excludes that   
   outright. He places the Word on the Creator side of the Creator–creature   
   divide. If the Word were a created “a god,” then He would have created   
   Himself—an absurdity.   
      
   And this language is not unique to the Word. Scripture uses the same   
   prepositions for the Father without implying He operates as someone   
   else’s subordinate agent.   
      
   “From him and through him and to him are all things” (Romans 11:36, ESV).   
   “Yet for us there is one God, the Father, from whom are all things and   
   for whom we exist” (1 Corinthians 8:6, ESV).   
      
   That same verse then says:   
      
   “And one Lord Jesus Christ, through whom are all things” (1 Corinthians   
   8:6, ESV).   
      
   The pattern is deliberate. The preposition does not diminish the Son. It   
   marks His divine activity in creation. What the Father does, the Word   
   does. John is not describing a creature. He is describing the eternal   
   Son who shares the same divine nature.   
      
   Your argument about the definite article misrepresents Greek grammar.   
   The omission in a predicate nominative describes *nature*, not   
   inferiority. John does the same thing that Scripture does everywhere else.   
      
   “God is spirit” (John 4:24, ESV).   
   “God is light” (1 John 1:5, ESV).   
   “God is love” (1 John 4:8, ESV).   
      
   You never translate those as “a spirit,” “a light,” or “a love.”   
   The   
   construction describes what God *is*, not a lesser category. John 1:1   
   uses the same pattern: the Word fully possesses the nature of God.   
      
   And now John 1:18 seals everything you try to undo:   
      
   “No one has ever seen God; the only God, who is at the Father’s side, he   
   has made him known” (John 1:18, ESV).   
      
   John identifies the One at the Father’s side as “the only God.” He does   
   not call Him “a god.” He does not say “a divine one.” He states that   
   the   
   One who reveals the Father shares the same unique deity as the Father   
   Himself. The Son dwells “at the Father’s side,” a phrase of eternal   
   fellowship. And He alone explains the unseen God because He alone shares   
   that divine essence.   
      
   John 1:1 declares His nature.   
   John 1:3 declares His work.   
   John 1:14 declares His incarnation.   
   John 1:18 declares His unique deity and eternal intimacy with the Father.   
      
   Your appeal to Barclay and fringe translations does nothing to change   
   what the inspired text states so plainly. “Divine” and “deity” never   
   support your claim that He is a lesser created being. You misuse their   
   wording to prop up a doctrine the text itself annihilates.   
      
   Your interpretation forces contradictions the Holy Spirit never placed   
   in the passage. John’s prologue proclaims:   
      
   • The Word eternally exists (“In the beginning was the Word,” John 1:1).   
   • The Word eternally fellowships with God (“the Word was with God,” John   
   1:1).   
   • The Word eternally shares God’s nature (“the Word was God,” John   
   1:1).   
   • The Word creates all things (John 1:3).   
   • The Word is the life and light of men (John 1:4).   
   • The Word becomes flesh (John 1:14).   
   • The Word is the only God at the Father’s side (John 1:18).   
      
   To defend annihilationism, you must deny every one of these truths.   
   To defend your diminished Christ, you must amputate the very verses that   
   reveal Him.   
      
   But Scripture leaves you no room to shrink Him down.   
   He is the eternal Word.   
   He is the Creator of all.   
   He is the only God at the Father’s side.   
   He is the One who died for our sins and rose again (1 Corinthians 15:3–4).   
   Reject Him, and you face what He Himself describes as “the fire that is   
   not quenched” (Mark 9:48 [Gehennah]).   
      
   Greek grammar will not rescue Heresy James from the Christ he denies.   
      
   --   
   Have you heard the good news Christ died for our sins (†), and God   
   raised Him from the dead?   
      
   That Christ died for our sins shows we're sinners who deserve the death   
   penalty. That God raised Him from the dead shows Christ's death   
   satisfied God's righteous demands against our sin (Romans 3:25; 1 John   
   2:1-2). This means God can now remain just, while forgiving you of your   
   sins, and saving you from eternal damnation.   
      
   On the basis of Christ's death and resurrection for our sins, call on   
   the name of the Lord to save you: "For 'everyone who calls on the name   
   of the Lord will be saved'" (Romans 10:13, ESV).   
      
   https://christrose.news/salvation   
      
   To automatically receive daily Bible teaching updates with colorful   
   images and website formatting, subscribe to my feed in a client like   
   Thunderbird:   
      
   https://www.christrose.news/feeds/posts/default   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)   

[   << oldest   |   < older   |   list   |   newer >   |   newest >>   ]


(c) 1994,  bbs@darkrealms.ca