XPost: alt.activism, alt.california, alt.politics.bush   
   XPost: alt.politics.republicans, ba.politics, ca.politics   
   From: standesd_DIGA_NO_A_SPAM@earthlink.net   
      
   "Thom"  wrote in message   
   news:40f20783.19377068@news.melbpc.org.au...   
   > On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 18:26:57 GMT, "kujebak"    
   > wrote:   
   >   
   > >   
   > >"Thom"  wrote in message   
   > >news:40f13075.13514088@news.melbpc.org.au...   
   > >> On Sun, 11 Jul 2004 02:14:54 GMT, Orval Fairbairn   
   > >>  wrote:   
   > >>   
   > >> >In article <40ee7b51.21427552@news.melbpc.org.au>,   
   > >> > thomandpam@yahoo.com.au (Thom) wrote:   
   > >> >   
   > >> >> On 12 Apr 2004 13:09:10 -0700, gimme_this_gimme_that@yahoo.com   
   (GIMME)   
   > >> >> wrote:   
   > >> >>   
   > >> >> >Comments follow ...   
   > >> >> >   
   > >> >> >> ...Socialism always moves toward more democracy and capitalism   
   > >always   
   > >> >> >> moves   
   > >> >> >> toward less. In fact the kind of global corporate capitalism that   
   is   
   > >so   
   > >> >> >> strenuously promoted today may be, as anyone from Thomas   
   Jefferson   
   > >to   
   > >> >> >> Ralph   
   > >> >> >> Nader to George Soros might assert, incompatible with democracy.   
   > >   
   > >Socialism doesn't always move toward more democracy. It always moves   
   toward   
   > >the "Dictatorship of the Proletariat", with all its hideous   
   implications -   
   > >forced conformity   
   > >to the lowest common intellectual and socio-economic denominator.   
   >   
   > You need to be clearer on that.  First of all socialism has to have a   
   > democratic environment to survive.  Socialism uses the best parts of   
   > the left and right.  It provides basic services so companies don't   
   > have to have them as part of their price structures, an example is   
   > company provided health care.  If this overhead is removed, the worker   
   > gets more pay, the product sells for less and the company makes more   
   > money.   
   >   
   > Since Government is people doing as a whole what they can not do as   
   > individuals then it makes sense.  It is the responsibility of   
   > government to create those conditions where ALL (not just fat cat   
   > CEO's) can prosper.  This is the way it must be till money is no   
   > longer used and wealth is no longer a social priority.   
   > >   
   > >> >> >   
   > >> >> >Socialism resolves toward oppression as described in my writings   
   > >> >> >by George Orwell.   
   > >> >>   
   > >> >> Socialism is the opposite of oppression and empowers the individual   
   > >> >> against corporations.   
   > >> >   
   > >> >   
   > >> >Ah, but it empowers government, which has the police power, to oppress   
   > >> >the individual.   
   > >>   
   > >> Like it is now?  Gun control, attacking religions in Waco they don't   
   > >> like, attacking survivalists like Randy Weaver etc etc etc.  Anything   
   > >> is an improvcement over the Bush Ragime.   
   > >   
   > >It seems you are not old enough to remember who ordered the genocidal   
   > >attack on Waco.   
   >   
   > During the Bush 41 administration a series of 9 attacks were planned   
   > and approved by the White House and JD.  Each had a socicio-political   
   > agenda.  The first was to snuff out the survivalist movement and Randy   
   > Weaver was chosen as the target.  Next was a group of religious   
   > communalists in Texas whose land was also wanted by a developer friend   
   > of Bush.  Next was a family in Colorado Springs who were part of the   
   > "self-government Movement".  Ruby and Waco hit but when Colorado   
   > Springs hit the neighbors revolted and basically went up against the   
   > BAFT thugging their neighborhood.  The media decended and the BATF   
   > backed off and another WACO was averted.   
   >   
   > >You are obviously not old enough to understand the true   
   > >nature of  socialism revealed by the real-life experiments in Eastern   
   > >Europe.   
   >   
   > I live in a socialist country and the city I live in is year after   
   > year found to be the "Most Livable City" in the world.   
   >   
   > >Take it from one who took part in one of those experiments - there ain't   
   no   
   > >such thing as "Socialism with a Human Face". The ultimate goal of   
   socialism   
   > >NOT economic equity. Have you ever wondered why some of socialism's   
   > >most influential proponents in this country (like Soros) are also some of   
   > >the   
   > >wealthiest? The commissar rulers of the Soviet Union and the sycophant   
   > >Eastern European dictatorships all had multimillion  bank accounts in   
   > >Switzerland. Socialism is all about imposing absolute conformity and   
   > >destroying all manifestations of individuality (turning human society   
   into   
   > >an anthill), which, of course, was the main reason for its ultimate   
   failure.   
   >   
   > Oh Bull!  socialism is no such thing.  That's communism and   
   > capitalism, they just use different methods.   
      
   You truly have no clue...   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)