XPost: news.groups, rec.arts.comics.dc.universe, rec.arts.sf.tv   
   XPost: rec.arts.tv   
   From: kalelfan@yanospamhoo.com   
      
   Mark wrote:   
      
   > qartl wrote:   
      
   [qart1 was responding to Nicolaas Vroom, the poster who started the   
   original 200+ post thread in the moderated news.groups.proposals;   
   Nicolaas too had just had a rejected post]   
      
   >> As you have just discovered, any negative comments about the Board or   
   >> members of the Board are automatically "offensive" and "impolite",   
   >> regardless of technical merit.   
   >   
   > Not only that, but now "I disagree with your opinion" is cause for   
   > rejection, at least from one moderator of ngp.  Who will then try to   
   > start a discussion via email about that opinion.   
      
   "Disagree with your opinion?"  Ha!  I've got that beat:   
      
      "Yours is only one of many articles I'm rejecting for incivility.   
      None is really a flame, but each of them tends to add to an   
      escalation of feeling, so I am rejecting all of them"   
      
   Feelings... woe..woe.woe... feelings.  Following was the post, but first   
   the warning intro courtesy Bill O'Reilly...   
      
   CAUTION!  You have entered the No Feeling Zone!  The post   
   below has been certified to cause an escalation of feeling in   
   Bambis.  If you are a Bambi, stop reading now and turn to   
   PBS!   
      
   B   
   A   
   M   
   B   
   I   
      
   I   
   S   
      
   I   
   N   
      
   D   
   A   
   N   
   G   
   E   
   R   
      
   S   
   P   
   A   
   C   
   E   
      
   > "Brad Templeton"  wrote in message   
   > news:XIudnWV7Dbw4R4XQnZ2dnUVZ_q6dnZ2d@posted.rawbandwidth...   
   >   
   > [Brad was responding to Alexander]   
   >   
   > > No, I know that USENET's decline has led to this.   
   >   
   > Yep.   
   >   
   > > However, to my mind, a dead moderated group causes only a   
   > > minor harm,   
   >   
   > At this point in Usenet History, yep again.   
   >   
   > > ... and the effort to fix it should be dependent on enthusiasm   
   > > from those who wish to read or participate in such a group.   
   >   
   > Which isn't really that high on Usenet generally, probably even   
   > less so for the moderated groups that are all completely ad-hoc   
   > and difficult to find, and from the sounds of it hasn't really been   
   > the case for years in rec.humor.funny either.  So I think in this   
   > case it should be seen as a balance between a few (?) complaints,   
   > or some dubious rm policy, and your long history with the group.   
   >   
   > If Board policies prevent that kind of balanced consideration,   
   > I'd be proposing a change in the policies based on this specific   
   > case demonstrating the need for it.   
   >   
   > > No need for those who don't even care enough to try the   
   > > most basic things like web searches to reach a moderator   
   > > to do bulk rmgroups.   
   >   
   > I agree there too, but probably more generally in the sense that   
   > all these MVIs should be abandoned in favor of a Bigger Picture   
   > conceptual approach to Usenet's decline.  What I think should   
   > happen, at best or worst depending on how any given person   
   > looks at it, is that sufficient complaints without objection lead   
   > to a straightforward appointment of a new moderator if one   
   > can be found.  With objection, from the moderator or founder   
   > of a moderated group for example, or from any user in the case   
   > of an existing unmoderated group, the MVI or any rm attempt   
   > should be stopped.   
   >   
   > Any existing moderator saying to the Big 8 Board "Yep, I'm still   
   > alive here but I've been busy and haven't bothered with the   
   > handful of submissions I got over the last two years.  I'd still   
   > like to hang onto the group though, maybe get it going again   
   > if Usenet somehow comes back and there's enough interest..."   
   > should be able to.  If it's been without a post for two years   
   > or whatever it's not a crisis that a few have complained, nor   
   > an emergency that it be removed if there's even fewer or no   
   > complaints. Again, I think any plan here should at least be   
   > trying to address the root causes of Usenet's decline.   
   >   
   > Even the Cylons had a Plan, right Brad?  I can't remember   
   > what it was now.  :-)   
   >   
   > I've been following this thread for a bit, basically since Brad's   
   > name came up.  Fair disclosure, I like Brad and recall discussions   
   > we had on the BSG group where we were both active a few years   
   > back (had our disagreements too! :-)).  I'd also seen some of his   
   > FAQ material on copyright as far back as 10 to 15 years ago.   
   >   
   > So my initial thought was to try to find out a bit more, and I   
   > did (several days ago).  Correct me if I'm wrong but Brad has   
   > basically been "The Man" if we can use that term, when it comes   
   > to these rec.humor.funny moderated groups from their get-go   
   > 15 years ago or whenever it was.  He founded or was the initial   
   > proponent and got it going?   
   >   
   > That tended to strengthen my view that Brad and not the Big 8   
   > Board was the much more sympathetic player here, even setting   
   > aside the pre-existing favorable view that I had and that it seems   
   > Aahz and probably many others have towards Brad.   
   >   
   > But I just kept reading, and there were a few posts that I'd   
   > particularly noticed that I'll respond to here or on news.groups   
   > (because my Optional Moderation posts will be moving over   
   > there in a new phase of that).  I think just the existence of this   
   > discussion and the way it's played out is an extremely relevant   
   > example of where Usenet is at right now and how some of the   
   > focus and process has just gone completely upside down and   
   > bass ackwards.   
      
   In fact I have two Bambi-ville stories but we'll leave it at the   
   above for now.  "Moderation" of the kind alluded to above is   
   why people dislike moderation.  :-)  It's why the conventional   
   moderation approach has never "sold" very well on Usenet,   
   and never will.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)