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   alt.bible.prophecy      Debating whatever bible prophecies      115,092 messages   

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   Message 114,876 of 115,092   
   Christ Rose to All   
   10 Bible Evidences Signs Gifts Ceased (2   
   11 Oct 25 21:51:40   
   
   [continued from previous message]   
      
           Hebrews says that gospel "was confirmed" by the "signs",   
           "wonders" and "miracles". The Greek verb here is ebebaiĹ   
   thē   
           (ἐβεβαιώθη), from the verb bebaioĹ   
   , meaning “to confirm,   
           establish, make firm.” It is in the aorist passive indicative,   
           which points to a completed action in the past. It has no   
           indication of ongoing confirmation. This refers to how God   
           once-for-all validated the gospel message through the apostolic   
           generation. God now expects believers to believe the gospel on   
           the basis of past confirmation.   
      
           Likewise, by the time John wrote his gospel, he expected people   
           to believe in Jesus and the gospel on the basis of his own   
           testimony about the signs and wonders:   
      
           “Now Jesus did many other signs in the presence of the disciples,   
           which are not written in this book; but these are written so   
           that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God,   
           and that by believing you may have life in his name.” (John   
           20:30–31, ESV)   
      
           The written testimony of Scripture is what the Holy Spirit now   
           uses to bear witness to the signs and wonders. Clearly, God now   
           expects people to believe in Jesus on the basis of this   
           Bible testimony. There is no deficiency in Scripture to   
           persuade people to believe in Jesus Christ, that the Bible   
           should have to be continually confirmed over and over again,   
           after God already confirmed it.   
      
           Charismatics like to pretend like you're the one who lacks faith   
           if you don't believe signs and wonders are still happening   
           today. Yet it is they who lack faith in Scripture to believe   
           what God has already confirmed and declared in the Scriptures.   
      
         4) An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign (Matthew   
            12:39):   
      
          “But He answered and said to them, “An evil and adulterous   
           generation eagerly seeks for a sign...” (Matthew 12:39, LSB)   
      
           When Jesus said, “An evil and adulterous generation eagerly seeks   
           for a sign” (Matthew 12:39, LSB), He was rebuking the Jewish   
           leaders who demanded miraculous proof even after witnessing His   
           works. They were not seeking truth—they were testing God. Their   
           desire for signs wasn’t based in faith, but in stubborn   
           unbelief.   
      
           Jesus had already performed many miracles that clearly pointed to   
           His identity as the Messiah. Yet they refused to believe,   
           always asking for more. This constant demand for signs revealed   
           a heart that was unfaithful to God—“adulterous”—chasing after   
           wonders rather than receiving the truth already revealed. True   
           faith doesn’t need a sign to believe; it believes based on   
           God’s Word.   
      
           This further supports the idea that signs were never meant to be   
           a permanent feature of God’s dealings with His people. When   
           people continually crave signs, they’re aligning themselves   
           with the same faithless spirit Jesus condemned.   
      
         5) We hear nothing about signs, wonders, or miracles in the   
            churches after the book of Galatians.   
      
           After the book of Galatians, the New Testament shifts its focus   
           away from the outward sign gifts—tongues, prophecy, healing,   
           and miracles—and instead emphasizes faith, sound doctrine,   
           perseverance, and the fruit of the Spirit. This silence is not   
           accidental; it reflects the maturing of the church and the   
           fading role of signs, which had already served their   
           foundational purpose.   
      
           In Galatians itself (written early), Paul refers to miracles in   
           3:5: “Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles   
           among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith?”   
           (Galatians 3:5, ESV). But after this point—through Ephesians,   
           Philippians, Colossians, the Thessalonian letters, the   
           Pastorals (1–2 Timothy and Titus), and even Philemon—there is   
           not one mention of tongues, prophecy, or miraculous healings   
           being practiced in the churches. The absence is striking.   
      
         6) Paul counselled sick people to take medicine, not seek faith   
            healings.   
      
           Paul urges Timothy to take a little wine for his stomach and   
           frequent ailments (1 Timothy 5:23), mentions that he had to   
           leave Trophimus sick in Miletus (2 Timothy 4:20), and   
           emphasizes the endurance of suffering rather than the removal   
           of it. In every case, there is no appeal to miraculous healing   
           or tongues as a solution or evidence of spiritual vitality.   
           Even Paul’s own thorn in the flesh remains (2 Corinthians   
           12:7–9), and God’s answer is not healing, but grace. There's no   
           indication Paul rebuked Timothy for a "lack of faith".   
      
           This silence shows a natural shift from the early, sign-filled   
           period meant to *confirm* the gospel (Hebrews 2:3–4), to a   
           settled era where faith rests on the Word, not on visible   
           wonders. By the time of the later epistles, the foundation had   
           been laid, and the church was being built up through teaching,   
           exhortation, love, and endurance—no longer through signs and   
           wonders.   
      
         7) John mentions nothing about signs and wonders when showing how   
            to discern who are the children of God.   
      
           In his epistles, the Apostle John is deeply concerned with   
           helping believers know who truly belongs to God. But when he   
           lays out the tests for discerning the children of God, he says   
           nothing about signs, wonders, tongues, or miracles. This is   
           telling.   
      
           In 1 John 3:10, John writes, “By this it is evident who are the   
           children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever   
           does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one   
           who does not love his brother” (1 John 3:10, ESV). The mark of   
           a child of God is righteous living and brotherly love—not   
           spiritual manifestations.   
      
           Throughout 1 John, the apostle offers several criteria by which   
           believers can test the genuineness of others—and themselves:   
      
           • Confessing Jesus Christ has come in the flesh (1 John 4:2)   
           • Obedience to God’s commandments (1 John 2:3–4)   
           • Not loving the world (1 John 2:15)   
           • Loving fellow believers (1 John 3:14)   
           • Practicing righteousness (1 John 3:7–10)   
           • Holding to apostolic teaching (1 John 4:6)   
      
           These are the Spirit-produced fruits that identify someone as a   
           true child of God. But nowhere does John say, “Look for those   
           who speak in tongues,” or, “Watch for those who heal or   
           prophesy.” In fact, when he warns about false prophets and the   
           spirit of antichrist, he gives the test of doctrine—what they   
           believe about Jesus—not their ability to perform signs (1 John   
           4:1–3).   
      
           This silence confirms that by the time of John’s writing—likely   
           the latest of the apostles—the sign gifts were no longer the   
           measure of spirituality or legitimacy. The church was to test   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)   

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