XPost: alt.christnet.christianlife, alt.religion.christian, alt.   
   hristnet.christnews   
   From: usenet@christrose.news   
      
   ========================================   
   Tue, 30 Sep 2025 11:38:15 -0700   
   <10bh82n$3sduh$1@dont-email.me>   
   "Robert" (a.k.a "None", "Dr. Who",   
   "Anonymous", "HTH", "ahisrwic", "Rock", "KK") wrote:   
   ========================================   
   > On Sep 28, 2025, Christ Rose wrote   
   > (Message-ID:):   
   >   
   >>> Yet “christians†harbor the thoughts of satan teaching that the   
   >>> gifts of the Holy Spirit of God, wane.   
   >>   
   >> Notice how he tries to associate any denial of charismatic lies with the   
   >> teaching of Satan, without any evidence whatsoever. Jesus said the opposite:   
   >>   
   >> “An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign...”(Matthew   
   >> 16:4, ESV)   
   >>   
   >> If anything, Satan is trying to get people to seek after signs rather   
   >> than walk by faith in God's word.   
   >   
   > I am going to present a new commandment of Jesus in order to establish a base   
   > as well as the reasoning behind it, per God.   
      
      
   After a careful review of everything "Robert" wrote below, there was not   
   a single shred of evidence anywhere in anything he said which either   
   shows from the Bible that sign gifts must continue until Christ returns,   
   or that denying that sign gifts must persist until Christ returns is an   
   unpardonable sin.   
      
      
   > Jhn 13:34-35   
   >   
   > 34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have   
   > loved you, that ye also love one another.   
      
      
   Notice, LOVE (not signs and wonders) is the primary evidence of the Holy   
   Spirit's work in a believer's life. But that's not what Charismatics   
   teach. They try to make people doubt their salvation, or think they're   
   carnal and lacking faith in God UNLESS they seek after signs and   
   wonders. That's the perfect antithesis to what Jesus taught.   
      
      
   > 35 By this shall allmenknow that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to   
   > another.   
      
      
   idem.   
      
      
   > Here is the understanding of that, in practice.   
   >   
   > 1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the   
   > devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that   
   > loveth not his brother.   
      
      
   Notice, there's again nothing there about how the child of God should be   
   believing in and/or performing signs and wonders either. The entire   
   epistle of 1 John, while it explains how to discern a child of God from   
   a child of the devil, says NOTHING whatsoever about the child of God   
   having faith to perform miracles or signs and wonders. It's all about   
   love for other believers, practicing right living, etc. That's how John   
   counseled the churches to discern those who were of God rather than the   
   devil. "Robert" cites these passages, as if it proves that you're carnal   
   and lacking faith unless you seek after and believe signs and wonders   
   are for the church today. They show just the opposite.   
      
      
   > This is the truth of the Lord,   
      
      
   ...and so far it shows that love, not signs and wonders is the evidence   
   of the Spirit's work in a believer's life.   
      
      
   > and it is not for me to judge, let God and the others judge.   
      
      
   (..He says as he labors in judgment to poison people's minds against   
   those who proclaim sound Bible doctrine while he promotes carnal,   
   Charismatic lies.)   
      
      
   > Now onwards to the scripture used without understanding.   
      
      
   (by "Robert")   
      
      
   > As Taught by the Lord.   
      
      
   (He claims...)   
      
      
   > Charismatic? Gifts of the Spirit?   
      
      
   Notice the lie. He says "gifts of the Spirit", as if I were denying that   
   ANY gifts of the Spirit are for today. I've never said any such thing,   
   but specifically referred to "sign gifts" like speaking in tongues and   
   healings. He can't refute what was actually stated, so he builds a   
   falsehood and pretends to defeat it, when it was never what the other   
   person said to begin with.   
      
      
   > Those who claim that these things are of   
   > the devil?   
      
      
      
   Notice, it is "Robert" who claimed to the effect that people who DO NOT   
   believe sign gifts are for today are acting by Satan. Yet Jesus clearly   
   stated:   
      
         “...An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign...”   
          (Matthew 12:39, ESV)   
      
      
   Would Jesus lead people to seek after signs and wonders? No. He would   
   expect them to believe on the testimony of His apostles, just as He did   
   doubting Thomas in John 20.   
      
      
   > Healings, Casting out demons, miracles, all done as the spirit of   
   > God dispenses them severally amongst men?   
      
      
   Notice, he still isn't showing a shred of Bible evidence that signs and   
   wonders were intended to persist until Christ returns. 1 Corinthians 13   
   directly states where there are tongues they shall cease. The word cease   
   is in the middle voice meaning cease of themselves. While prophecy and   
   knowledge are said to be made to cease by the coming of "the perfect",   
   tongues is not made to stop by the coming of the perfect. They just stop   
   by themselves. They had a predetermined purpose and when that purpose   
   was fulfilled, they ceased of themselves.   
      
      
      
   > Here is what Jesus said in regards to the Pharisaical ones of his day. Those   
   > who claimed to follow the scriptures....   
   >   
   > Blasphemy Against the Holy Spirit   
   >   
   > Mat 12:22 Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and   
   > dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw.   
   >   
   > Mat 12:23 And all the people were amazed, and said, Is not this the son of   
   > David?   
   >   
   > Mat 12:24 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not   
   > cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils.   
   >   
   > Mat 12:25 And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom   
   > divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house   
   > divided against itself shall not stand:   
   >   
   > Mat 12:26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how   
   > shall then his kingdom stand?   
   >   
   > Mat 12:27 And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children   
   > cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges.   
   >   
   > Mat 12:28 But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of   
   > God is come unto you.   
      
      
      
   Which proves Jesus cast out demons by the power of the Holy Spirit. I   
   never claimed He did not, or that He did it by the power of Satan. Thus,   
   you have no actual arguments from Scripture which show that signs and   
   wonders must persist until Jesus returns. You have your own straw-man   
   lies which YOU read into the conversation, and now pretend to refute.   
      
      
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
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