[continued from previous message]   
      
   your conscious mind was interested in it.  And no one showed you   
   anything -- unless, of course, you're claiming you're unfamiliar with   
   the Bible.   
      
   >> > > > It was a point that the young man made about Jesus   
   >> > > > the prayers of man that he blessed and then handed it to the Heavenly   
   >> > > > Father   
   >> > > > to bless, and return the answers for them. It is also backed up in   
   >> > > > scripture   
   >> > > > From the first chapter of Genesis on.   
   >> > >   
   >> > > No, the plural of God in the book of Genesis is just a remnant of   
   >> > > early Israelite polytheism. It has nothing to do with God the Father.   
   >> >   
   >> > It was mentioned before there were any Israelites. The young man mentioned   
   >> > the realities of that without making a big point about it, for which I’d   
   >> > bet many religious types will flack him for it, as well as calling him a   
   >> > total fraud because it does not match up with their supposed doctrines of   
   >> > men. Jesus when he returned to the Father was seated at the right hand of   
   >> > the Heavenly Father. NOT on the throne of the Heavenly Father.   
   >>   
   >> No, the setting of the story in Genesis is pre-Israelite but in   
   >> reality it was composed in Israel much later than that. And Jesus   
   >> sitting at the right hand of his Father is a remnant from the early   
   >> days of Jesus' preachings, when he was considered to be somewhat less   
   >> of a ruler than his Father was.   
   >   
   >Did you bother to read what I said? It sure does not look like it.   
      
   Read it?  The whole paragraph is a rebuttal of what you said.   
      
   >> > > > > > > > > Oh, and also he doesn't close his eyes when he prays. I   
   >> > > found that   
   >> > > > > > > > > to be kind of strange.   
   >> > > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > > Many others do as well, I say that because of several leaders   
   I know   
   >> > > > > > > > do   
   >> > > > > > > > it   
   >> > > > > > > > both ways in public. There is no formula for prayers. After   
   all, in   
   >> > > > > > > > the   
   >> > > > > > > > old   
   >> > > > > > > > days when one presented their case to their kings for   
   consideration,   
   >> > > > > > > > they   
   >> > > > > > > > did   
   >> > > > > > > > so with eyes open when they said, I pray thee Lord so and so.   
   >> > > > > > > > In speaking to God he sees the heart and its intent.   
   >> > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > So do you pray to God with your eyes open? Why or why not?   
   >> > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > Sometimes either way. If I my driving and I see something like an   
   >> > > > > > accident   
   >> > > > > > with people attending to whoever was involved I pray for them in a   
   >> > > > > > variety   
   >> > > > > > of   
   >> > > > > > ways. Obviously with my eyes open. Sometimes I do the same when I   
   am   
   >> > > > > > reading,   
   >> > > > > > or writing, or see and or hear news of bad things happening, same   
   when   
   >> > > > > > good   
   >> > > > > > things are happening to give praise. At home in private, normally   
   I   
   >> > > > > > close   
   >> > > > > > my   
   >> > > > > > eyes Just because...and it helps keep one focused.   
   >> > > > >   
   >> > > > > Wow. Do you even bow when you pray, to at least show respect for   
   your   
   >> > > > > god?   
   >> > > >   
   >> > > > And home I bend the knee to him. And on occasion on my face,   
   depending.   
   >> > > > He saved me both in this life as well as the next. He spared my life   
   >> > > > several   
   >> > > > times, and I cannot thank him enough for that.   
   >> > >   
   >> > > But if he hadn't saved your life, you would be in heaven right now,   
   >> > > wouldn't you? Is that situation good or bad? And why would God spare   
   >> > > your life and not others?   
   >> >   
   >> > Perhaps, I don’t really know for sure, because at those times my life was   
   >> > not right before God. He saved me I am sure because of a couple things,   
   one   
   >> > he wanted me to be spiritually saved, the other because of the prayers of   
   my   
   >> > concerned mother. I know that the fear of death was not with me. Only   
   that I   
   >> > knew at that time is was a very real possibility. I cannot fully   
   understand   
   >> > it, neither then or afterwards, or even now. I am however, thankful to Him   
   >> > for it.   
   >>   
   >> Why couldn't you go to heaven and get spiritually saved there?   
   >> Wouldn't that be fun?   
   >   
   >Those that die and are not of God, go to hell.Sin is not allowed in heaven, I   
   >suppose you could have a vision of heaven, so as to see what truth and life   
   >is like and the same thing with hell.   
      
   So you just didn't want to go to heaven at that point in your life?   
      
   >> > > > > > > > > > If you cared about your life after death, then you should   
   check your   
   >> > > > > > > > > > options.   
   >> > > > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > > > I don't care about it strictly because I don't believe it.   
   It's not   
   >> > > > > > > > > as if I saw, it believed it, and decided not to "check my   
   options."   
   >> > > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > > Yet you cannot deny that you never heard of it. So when you   
   see the   
   >> > > > > > > > reality   
   >> > > > > > > > of it that you won’t be able to say ‘I was never warned’.   
   >> > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > There is insufficient evidence to constitute being "warned."   
   >> > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > Not at all, because someone ignores it and acts all indifferent   
   to a   
   >> > > > > > warning   
   >> > > > > > because they did not feel any imminent threat or danger does not   
   dismiss   
   >> > > > > > or   
   >> > > > > > diminish the warning. Noah warned men of the impending flood for   
   120   
   >> > > > > > years   
   >> > > > > > as he and his family built the ark. All he got was jeers,   
   mocking, etc.   
   >> > > > > > but   
   >> > > > > > when   
   >> > > > > > he got into the ark and sealed the doors and then there came rain   
   and it   
   >> > > > > > did   
   >> > > > > > not stop. You can bet people changed their minds.   
   >> > > > >   
   >> > > > > If God sets things up so that they look like they can be mocked, and   
   >> > > > > then those things are mocked, whose fault is that?   
   >> > > >   
   >> > > > It depends on your view point, mine is different. In any event, when   
   the   
   >> > > > rains started pouring down, and the water started rising, the mocking   
   >> > > > stopped. Why was that?   
   >> > >   
   >> > > The point is, there should've been no mocking to begin with, if God   
   >> > > were sensible.   
   >> >   
   >> > Why is that? Is it not part of human nature that it born into sin to mock   
   >> > God and those who follow him?   
   >>   
   >> It's human nature to mock the laughing stocks, not those who are worth   
   >> dealing with.   
   >   
   >Human nature is not Godly. IOW not of God.   
      
   Obviously, it doesn't have to be of God, to be interested in laughing   
   at the laughable.   
      
   >> > > > > > > > > > Why? Because the default is Hell and then the Lake of   
   Fire.   
   >> > > > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > > > The idea of Hell is pure barbarism.   
   >> > > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > > That too is the thought of those against the death penalty   
   for rape   
   >> > > > > > > > and   
   >> > > > > > > > murder. And the same arguments are made against that. In   
   spite of the   
   >> > > > > > > > fact   
   >> > > > > > > > that these people are often repeat offenders. Now that same   
   thinking   
   >> > > > > > > > is   
   >> > > > > > > > in   
   >> > > > > > > > place in many cities for any crime resulting in Prison time.   
   >> > > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > > Torture has no place in a civilized society, regardless of the   
   crime,   
   >> > > > > > > so it's far less civilized if it goes on for *years* -- or   
   worst of   
   >> > > > > > > all, *forever.*   
   >> > > > > >   
   >> > > > > > Some people get their kicks from being tortured. Even pay for it.   
   >> > > > > > There are many forms of torment. And there are varying degrees of   
   >> > > > > > torment   
   >> > > > > > in   
      
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   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)