XPost: alt.christnet.christnews, alt.religion.christian   
   From: usenet@christrose.news   
      
   ========================================   
   Thu, 20 Nov 2025 15:11:52 -0500   
   <3f6uhk55ta73bonnm4lh7muvuvronsuru1@4ax.com>   
   "Sincerely", "soley from the Bible" and   
   "Honestly is my middle name"   
   James  wrote:   
   ========================================   
   >> • Revelation states that anyone not found in the book of life is cast   
   >>       into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:15).   
   > True. And "death" and "hell" are also tossed into there. (Rev 20:14)   
   >   
   > And the Bible clearly tells us what the Lake of Fire REPRESENTS, IS   
   > SYMBOLIC OF, ILLUSTRATIVE, FIGURATIVE, EMBLEMATIC OF:   
   >   
   > THE SECOND DEATH! (Rev 20:14)   
   >   
   > Also, you are in a book (Rev) that is almost pure symbolism; dragon,   
   > multiheaded beasts, etc.   
      
      
   Self-deluded liar.   
      
   You pretend as if the mere possibility that something is "symbolic"   
   automatically makes it mean the opposite of what the "symbol" indicates,   
   and therefore that it supports your denials and contrary conclusions.   
      
   Symbols always convey realities that match the picture, not the opposite   
   of the picture. Dragons, beasts, bowls, trumpets, and lampstands   
   represent real judgments and real events. They never reverse the meaning   
   of the image. A symbol of judgment still communicates judgment, not   
   escape from it.   
      
   The vast majority of the "symbols" in Revelation are indicated by words   
   such as "like" or "as". For example, Jesus has hair "like" wool. His   
   voice is "as" the sound of many waters. These symbols do not indicate   
   that Jesus does NOT have a voice, or hair, but describe the literal   
   nature of his literal, existing voice and hair by comparing them to   
   things we understand.   
      
   Further, when Revelation is using symbols and does not say they are   
   “like” or “as,” it offers an explanation of what it literally means.   
   For   
   example,   
      
         "the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches"   
          (Revelation 1:20, ESV)   
      
         "the seven lampstands are the seven churches" (Revelation 1:20,   
          ESV)   
      
         "the great prostitute sits on many waters, and the waters are   
          peoples and multitudes and nations and languages" (Revelation   
          17:1; 17:15, ESV)   
      
         "the ten horns are ten kings" (Revelation 17:12, ESV)   
      
         "the fine linen stands for the righteous deeds of the saints"   
          (Revelation 19:8, ESV)   
      
   These explanations show that Revelation’s symbolism never reverses its   
   meaning. It reveals the literal reality behind the symbol.   
      
   Revelation 20:14 states, “Then Death and Hades were thrown into the lake   
   of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire” (Revelation 20:14,   
   ESV; hell [Hades]). The phrase “the second death” does not mean   
   non-existence. It describes the final and irreversible state of   
   separation from God under His wrath.   
      
   The lake of fire was prepared for spirit beings (Matthew 25:41, ESV;   
   hell [Gehenna]). Spirit beings do not die in the sense of ceasing to   
   exist. The devil, the beast, and the false prophet are thrown into the   
   same lake, and John wrote, “They will be tormented day and night forever   
   and ever” (Revelation 20:10, ESV). That proves the lake of fire is the   
   place of ongoing conscious torment, not extinction. The same lake   
   receives all whose names are not written in the book of life (Revelation   
   20:15, ESV). The destinies must be parallel because the location is the   
   same.   
      
   Revelation 14:11 gives the plainest description: “The smoke of their   
   torment goes up forever and ever, and they have no rest, day or night”   
   (Revelation 14:11, ESV). Symbolic language never contradicts its own   
   interpretation. If the symbol is fire, the interpretation is torment. If   
   the smoke rises forever, the torment continues forever. A vanished   
   person produces no rising smoke and needs no rest.   
      
   Jesus taught that Gehenna contains fire that “is not quenched” and a   
   worm that “does not die” (Mark 9:48, ESV; hell [Gehenna]). Those images   
   come from Isaiah 66:24, describing ongoing, conscious disgrace. The   
   point of the imagery is unending judgment. Perpetual fire and undying   
   worms have no purpose if all the judged vanish instantly.   
      
   The second death is final, irreversible ruin under God’s wrath—eternal   
   separation with no relief, not the end of personal existence. Symbols   
   communicate truths consistent with their images, not the opposite of them.   
      
   --   
   Have you heard the good news Christ died for our sins (†), and God   
   raised Him from the dead?   
      
   That Christ died for our sins shows we're sinners who deserve the death   
   penalty. That God raised Him from the dead shows Christ's death   
   satisfied God's righteous demands against our sin (Romans 3:25; 1 John   
   2:1-2). This means God can now remain just, while forgiving you of your   
   sins, and saving you from eternal damnation.   
      
   On the basis of Christ's death and resurrection for our sins, call on   
   the name of the Lord to save you: "For 'everyone who calls on the name   
   of the Lord will be saved'" (Romans 10:13, ESV).   
      
   https://christrose.news/salvation   
      
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   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)