XPost: alt.christnet.christnews, alt.religion.christian   
   From: usenet@christrose.news   
      
   On 1/28/2026 12:07 PM, James wrote:   
   >>       “The hill and the watchtower will become dens forever [olam]…   
   >>        until the Spirit is poured upon us” (Isaiah 32:14–15, ESV).   
   >>   
   >> Olam explicitly ends when God acts.   
      
   > That is obvious. It says "until".   
      
   Exactly. And that is the nail in the coffin for the argument you were   
   trying to defend earlier.   
      
   Isaiah does not just *allow* olam to end. It *explicitly defines its   
   endpoint*.   
      
   “The hill and the watchtower will become dens forever [olam] … *until*   
   the Spirit is poured upon us from on high” (Isaiah 32:14–15, ESV).   
      
   The text itself tells you:   
   – olam is operative   
   – olam has a terminus   
   – the terminus comes when God acts   
      
   That means olam does *not* mean “endless by default.” It means “enduring   
   for the full span God appoints,” whether that span is short, long,   
   lifelong, covenantal, generational, or—when the subject requires   
   it—eternal.   
      
   And now step back and look at the cumulative force of the evidence you   
   yourself have acknowledged:   
      
   – Samuel’s service called olam, defined as “as long as he lives” (1   
   Samuel 1:22, 28).   
   – Lifelong servitude called olam (Deuteronomy 15:17).   
   – Memorial stones called olam, lasting as long as the memorial stands   
   (Joshua 4:7).   
   – Ancient doors called olam (Psalm 24:7).   
   – Mountains called olam, yet scattered when God acts (Habakkuk 3:6).   
   – Devastation called olam, explicitly ending “until” God pours out His   
   Spirit (Isaiah 32:14–15).   
      
   So when you now say, “That is obvious. It says ‘until,’” you have   
   conceded the governing rule:   
      
   *Olam lasts until God says otherwise.*   
      
   And that brings us right back to the heavens and the earth.   
      
   Scripture does not merely imply an endpoint. It *states it outright*:   
      
   “They will perish… like a garment they will be changed” (Psalm 102:26,   
   ESV).   
   “The heavens will pass away with a roar” (2 Peter 3:10, ESV).   
   “From his presence earth and sky fled away” (Revelation 20:11, ESV).   
   “The first heaven and the first earth passed away” (Revelation 21:1, ESV).   
      
   So yes—your observation is correct.   
      
   And once that is admitted, appeals to “the earth remains forever” as   
   proof of absolute permanence collapse completely. Scripture itself   
   defines olam. Scripture itself defines its limits. Scripture itself   
   tells us when God acts.   
      
   And when God acts at the end, the present heavens and earth do not   
   merely continue.   
      
   They end.   
   They are changed.   
   They are replaced.   
      
   --   
   Have you heard the good news Christ died for our sins (†), and God   
   raised Him from the dead?   
      
   That Christ died for our sins shows we're sinners who deserve the death   
   penalty. That God raised Him from the dead shows Christ's death   
   satisfied God's righteous demands against our sin (Romans 3:25; 1 John   
   2:1-2). This means God can now remain just, while forgiving you of your   
   sins, and saving you from eternal damnation.   
      
   On the basis of Christ's death and resurrection for our sins, call on   
   the name of the Lord to save you: "For 'everyone who calls on the name   
   of the Lord will be saved'" (Romans 10:13, ESV).   
      
   https://christrose.news/salvation   
      
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    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)