From: word_chemist@hotmail.com   
      
   "Bayle"  wrote in message   
   news:1146078448.273257.253820@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...   
      
   >   
   > I've always felt that other than Martha perhaps, who to her credit is   
   > sincere, Allport and Gene among others were reacting to our tone not   
   > what we said.   
      
   Odd cove, Allport. Far too New Labourish for my kidney. Clever, mind you   
   (Big Ego: they ought have him on screen instead of the MGM lion at the start   
   of films). But he likes to win and control the terms of debate with an iron   
   fist. Now I ain't saying I don't like to win. But I'd never stoop to   
   Stalinist censorship - and the Allport Clique have got that running through   
   them like 'Brighton' through a stick of rock. Martha, with that creative,   
   now you see it now you don't way of the Nu-Left, called it 'editing'. Awwww.   
   Gene I always found all right - I never quite believed he'd be in favour of   
   Israel if he hadn't been one of God's chosen people in the first place, know   
   what I mean?   
      
    And now Gene's friends feel compelled to attempt to say   
   > to others much of what we said to them. And to what end? I don't feel   
   > that the authors of the Manifesto are decadent per se. I think they are   
   > speaking common sense for the most part. Is it decadent to expect their   
   > fellow socialists to listen to them?   
      
   No of course not, it just seems that for a group of people who always think   
   they are right, I mean seriously, irrefutably *correct*, to have to go   
   through their basic, shitty and hypocritical laundry just now indicates that   
   a lot of people have gone decadent somehwere...   
      
      
   >   
   > For the most part I use our ex-abgo freinds to triangulate what is   
   > happening in the real world. Because we were all so connected at one   
   > time around a particular set of beliefs. At  least I thought so. So if   
   > they can't talk to us what do they expect to accomplish? Another good   
   > question is, have they changed their minds about anything?   
      
   I'll have to go through it carefully. But really - when they airbushed   
   soviet communism and fudge Islamic fascism, then fuck 'em.   
      
   >   
   > In a sense the Euston Manifesto is a Liberal Manifesto in the old   
   > sense. The sense that makes many of us Liberals. A sense that makes the   
   > old left closer to us than this insane new new left - who is in fact   
   > the enemy.   
   >   
      
   That seems a fair appraisal.   
      
   ROBBIE   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)