From: punditster@gmail.com   
      
   On 1/13/2026 10:10 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   > On Tue, 13 Jan 2026 10:04:31 -0800, Dude  wrote:   
   >   
   >> On 1/13/2026 9:26 AM, Wilson wrote:   
   >>> On 1/12/2026 7:03 PM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>>> On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 15:42:55 -0500, Wilson    
   >>>> wrote:   
   >>>>   
   >>>>> On 1/12/2026 1:24 PM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>>>>> On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 12:50:31 -0500, Wilson    
   >>>>>> wrote:   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> On 1/12/2026 11:37 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>>>>>>> On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 10:55:14 -0500, Wilson    
   >>>>>>>> wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> On 1/12/2026 8:38 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 12 Jan 2026 01:31:52 -0800, dart200   
   >>>>>>>>>>  wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>> On 1/11/26 3:36 PM, vjp2.at@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> *+-how would we fund consumerism tho???   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> All the economists, right and left thik consumer spending is   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> unproductive,   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> which is why they would prefer a consumtion tax over an income   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> tax.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> consumers buying things is unproductive?? what in the fuck is   
   >>>>>>>>>>> the point   
   >>>>>>>>>>> of the economy even?? to make things that aren't consumed??   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> consumer spending is supposed to be the fucking bedrock   
   >>>>>>>>>>> guidance of the   
   >>>>>>>>>>> economic engine, that's the how the market is supposed to work. if   
   >>>>>>>>>>> consumers can't spend ... how in the fuck do we know what to   
   >>>>>>>>>>> produce, eh???   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> ofc we wouldn't need usury to fund consumer spending if they   
   >>>>>>>>>>> were paid   
   >>>>>>>>>>> more fairly regardless of whether we tax them or not. idk why ur   
   >>>>>>>>>>> bringing up tax that ain't the question here   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> Discourage consumprion, encourage income.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> THe problem is the right doesn't trust the left with two   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> taxes.  THey want   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> the left to admit defeat and repeal the income tax amendment   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> first.  But   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> tariffs are primarily how the USA was financed before an   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> income tax.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> i want us to stop using the federal govt, to do things that   
   >>>>>>>>>>> should be   
   >>>>>>>>>>> state level orchestration. the feds were supposed to be a   
   >>>>>>>>>>> *limited*   
   >>>>>>>>>>> power govt, not governing everything power govt   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> and fuck tariffs, eh??   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> #god   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> like bro ... u telling me the richest most powerful country on the   
   >>>>>>>>>>> planet can't complete on the open market without tariffs???   
   >>>>>>>>>>> where's the   
   >>>>>>>>>>> permanent state of many tariffs edition of us "capitalism"???   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> fucking ??   
   >>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>> Usury is an integral part of this system.  No way could consumerism   
   >>>>>>>>>> generate wealth for a few if they couldn't use money to make more   
   >>>>>>>>>> money.   
   >>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>> consumerism   
   >>>>>>>>>> tariffs   
   >>>>>>>>>> various tax schemes   
   >>>>>>>>>> politics   
   >>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>> Something is wrong with this system.  Perhaps we could think of   
   >>>>>>>>>> a new   
   >>>>>>>>>> one that has not been tried before.  Because, so far, nothing works   
   >>>>>>>>>> long term, which is why we are here fussing about the system   
   >>>>>>>>>> that we   
   >>>>>>>>>> are left with after the others failed.   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> Human beings want to matter, to feel important and appreciated,   
   >>>>>>>>> and by   
   >>>>>>>>> doing so improve their place in the world. So they do things to   
   >>>>>>>>> those   
   >>>>>>>>> ends. Whether or not they actually make things better for others is   
   >>>>>>>>> ultimately always secondary to those primary goals.   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> This is true of people everywhere. We are built by our evolution to   
   >>>>>>>>> improve our social status. Because having a high status conferred an   
   >>>>>>>>> increased chance of survival.   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> This is how we've been behaving:   
   >>>>>>>>>      > see that things aren't working as well as we think they   
   should   
   >>>>>>>>>      > design a solution to make things better (and improve the   
   >>>>>>>>> status of   
   >>>>>>>>> those involved in the repair)   
   >>>>>>>>>      > solution does not make everything better   
   >>>>>>>>>      > some things are even worse   
   >>>>>>>>>      > repeat   
   >>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>> So it is time for a new idea, not revert to an old idea like   
   >>>>>>>> libertarianism.   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> Because giving people that much freedom doesn't work for you, as I   
   >>>>>>> explained:   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> Because reverting to failed past ideas seems kinda stupid.  As you   
   >>>>>> mentioned once upon a time, those ideas were left behind for a reason   
   >>>>>> with intention to do things in a better way.  It occurs to me that   
   >>>>>> perhaps you don't like the better way that was chosen.  You really   
   >>>>>> have no interest in possible new ways of handling those old problems.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Leaving behind the ideals of liberty is the end of civilization.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> However, your definition of liberty does not rule us.  Let us return   
   >>>> to:  libertarianism was abandoned for a reason.  An improvement was   
   >>>> intended.  Discarding that improvement does not require returning to   
   >>>> old unworkable ideas.   
   >>>   
   >>> What I hear:  "Blah, blah, blah I don't like freedom and want the boot."   
   >>>   
   >> Is there something wrong with Sombrero? It's as if he opposed to almost   
   >> every statement that is posted here!   
   >   
   > Yours anyway.   
   >   
   It's not my liberty. Liberty belongs to everyone. We should all be equal   
   under the law.   
    >   
   >> The US government was founded on libertarian principles!   
   >   
   > Which were mostly abandoned about 125 years ago for good reason, which   
   > is why wilson thinks he needs to campaign for going back to those   
   > ideas.   
   >   
   Are you nuts? The US government is today still based on civil liberties:   
      
   Individual freedoms like free speech, privacy, right to bear arms, and   
   freedom of association, opposing government censorship.   
      
   Ever heard of the Statue of Liberty?   
    >   
   >> Libertarian principles in the U.S. government today emphasize individual   
   >> liberty, limited government, free markets, and non-interventionism.   
   >>   
   >> We studied this in junior college: US Goverment 101   
   >   
   > I suggest you find a 4 yr university.   
    >   
   This information you were supposed to learn in Middle School, Senor!   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)