From: fedora@fea.st   
      
   On Sat, 14 Feb 2026 13:14:07 -0800, Dude  wrote:   
      
   >On 2/14/2026 11:30 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >> On Sat, 14 Feb 2026 11:27:02 -0800, Dude  wrote:   
   >>   
   >>> On 2/13/2026 9:52 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>>> On Fri, 13 Feb 2026 09:27:41 -0800, Dude  wrote:   
   >>>>   
   >>>>> On 2/13/2026 9:14 AM, Wilson wrote:   
   >>>>>> On 2/13/2026 12:53 AM, dart200 wrote:   
   >>>>>>> On 2/12/26 9:15 AM, Wilson wrote:   
   >>>>>>>> On 2/12/2026 9:29 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> What I mean is that governments can grant that they will not impose   
   >>>>>>>>> certain situations on you, which they still might.   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> But as far as the universe is concerned.  You have no rights.  There   
   >>>>>>>>> is no natural law to base social structures on.   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> It there were  natural laws that are inherent, universal, and   
   >>>>>>>>> inalienable, derived from human nature and  reason rather than   
   granted   
   >>>>>>>>> by governments, to be inalienable natural laws, there would be no way   
   >>>>>>>>> to not receive them.  Nobody would die, everybody would have liberty,   
   >>>>>>>>> and loving spouses.  The truth is you have no right to such things,   
   >>>>>>>>> and far too many around the world don't have them.   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> To be natural laws that are inherent, universal, and inalienable,   
   they   
   >>>>>>>>> would have to apply to everybody in the world, not only americans.   
   And   
   >>>>>>>>> when suffering people come to america seeking a place where they can   
   >>>>>>>>> have such things, we could not send them back where they came from.   
   >>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>> That is a deliberate misstatement of what natural law is all about.   
   >>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>> Which is: There are certain principles that work better than others.   
   >>>>>>>> When human law and society aligns with those principles, the systems   
   >>>>>>>> created within that structure perform better, allowing greater human   
   >>>>>>>> flourishing.   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> what worked last century, may not work this century, and will not work   
   >>>>>>> next century   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>    > the "law" can change when as technology unfolds   
   >>>>>>>    >   
   >>>>>>>    > #god   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> That's not how universal principles work.   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> Things like:   
   >>>>>> - Don't steal   
   >>>>>> - Don't initiate harm to or murder other people   
   >>>>>> - Don't deliberately speak untruth   
   >>>>>> - Take responsibility for your actions   
   >>>>>> - Don't envy or promote resentment for what others have   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>> It kind of looks like two informants are not smarter than a fifth   
   >>>>> grader. Maybe they think communism is a better system. It's starting to   
   >>>>> look like that because they don't seem to have any cogent arguments for   
   >>>>> a closed society. YMMV.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Everyone that's been to school in the US and Europe learned that based   
   >>>>> on international law and philosophical tradition, humans are considered   
   >>>>> to have innate, inherent, and inalienable human rights.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Learned.  Right that is how social structures get passed down.  And   
   >>>> true they must be learned.   
   >>>>   
   >>>>> These rights are not granted by governments, but are possessed by every   
   >>>>> individual from birth simply by virtue of being human.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Unless they are not permitted by governments.   
   >>>>   
   >>>>> Including rights to life, liberty, and freedom, as established by the UN   
   >>>>> Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Maybe they need to get some   
   >>>>> smarts and read a history book.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Yes, too bad the un is so toothless.   
   >>>>   
   >>> So, we are agreed. People have inalienable rights. Thanks.   
   >>   
   >> Nope.  But you agree with yourself.   
   > >   
   >"We hold these truths to be self-evident."   
      
   In their opinion.  In which case it would not be necessary to   
   enumerate them.   
      
   >The phrase is in the second paragraph of the US Declaration of   
   >Independence, adopted by the Second Continental Congress on July 4, 1776.   
   --   
   Noah Sombrero mustachioed villain   
   Don't get political with me young man   
   or I'll tie you to a railroad track and   
   <<>> to <<>>   
   Who dares to talk to El Sombrero?   
   dares: Ned   
   does not dare: Julian  shrinks in horror and warns others away   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)