From: punditster@gmail.com
On 2/16/2026 10:45 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Feb 2026 18:39:09 -0000 (UTC), Tara
> wrote:
>
>> On Feb 16, 2026 at 1:20:14?PM EST, "Noah Sombrero" wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 16 Feb 2026 13:13:23 -0500, Noah Sombrero
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, 16 Feb 2026 17:57:17 -0000 (UTC), Tara
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Feb 16, 2026 at 12:20:53?PM EST, "Noah Sombrero"
wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, 16 Feb 2026 11:55:05 -0500, Wilson
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2/16/2026 11:19 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Mon, 16 Feb 2026 10:45:47 -0500, Wilson
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2/16/2026 8:53 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, 16 Feb 2026 05:02:33 +0000, Creon wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> At Sat, 14 Feb 2026 14:30:45 -0500, Noah Sombrero
wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sat, 14 Feb 2026 11:27:02 -0800, Dude
wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/13/2026 9:52 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, 13 Feb 2026 09:27:41 -0800, Dude
wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/13/2026 9:14 AM, Wilson wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/13/2026 12:53 AM, dart200 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/12/26 9:15 AM, Wilson wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 2/12/2026 9:29 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What I mean is that governments can grant that they will
not impose
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certain situations on you, which they still might.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But as far as the universe is concerned. You have no
rights. There
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is no natural law to base social structures on.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It there were natural laws that are inherent, universal,
and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> inalienable, derived from human nature and reason rather
than granted
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> by governments, to be inalienable natural laws, there
would be no way
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to not receive them. Nobody would die, everybody would
have liberty,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and loving spouses. The truth is you have no right to
such things,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and far too many around the world don't have them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To be natural laws that are inherent, universal, and
inalienable, they
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would have to apply to everybody in the world, not only
americans. And
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> when suffering people come to america seeking a place
where they can
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have such things, we could not send them back where they
came from.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is a deliberate misstatement of what natural law is
all about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Which is: There are certain principles that work better
than others.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> When human law and society aligns with those principles,
the systems
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> created within that structure perform better, allowing
greater human
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> flourishing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> what worked last century, may not work this century, and
will not work
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> next century
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the "law" can change when as technology unfolds
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> #god
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's not how universal principles work.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Things like:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Don't steal
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Don't initiate harm to or murder other people
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Don't deliberately speak untruth
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Take responsibility for your actions
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> - Don't envy or promote resentment for what others have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It kind of looks like two informants are not smarter than a
fifth
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> grader. Maybe they think communism is a better system. It's
starting to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> look like that because they don't seem to have any cogent
arguments for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a closed society. YMMV.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everyone that's been to school in the US and Europe learned
that based
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> on international law and philosophical tradition, humans are
considered
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to have innate, inherent, and inalienable human rights.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Learned. Right that is how social structures get passed down.
And
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> true they must be learned.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> These rights are not granted by governments, but are possessed
by every
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> individual from birth simply by virtue of being human.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Unless they are not permitted by governments.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Including rights to life, liberty, and freedom, as established
by the UN
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Universal Declaration of Human Rights. Maybe they need to get
some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> smarts and read a history book.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yes, too bad the un is so toothless.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> So, we are agreed. People have inalienable rights. Thanks.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Nope. But you agree with yourself.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I agree with a lot of what you say, Noah, but not this.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The idea that there are universal, inalienable rights is undone as
>>>>>>>>>> soon as somebody disagrees with it.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Some rights are inherently part of a human being -- I use
>>>>>>>>>>> the term "God-given", and perhaps I should star that with the
>>>>>>>>>>> caveat that "God", to me, is mostly "Logos" -- the Logos of
>>>>>>>>>>> Heraclitus, c. 500BCE
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> That idea is part of the attitude of those of us who enjoy such govt
>>>>>>>>>> given rights. It allows us to not pay attention to those who enjoy
no
>>>>>>>>>> such rights. It, after all, is not the fault of evil govt since
they
>>>>>>>>>> have no power to take away such rights, as they obviously do exactly
>>>>>>>>>> that. So, of course, we have no duty to confront such govts.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It is strange sometimes to watch the contortions of human thought.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He used "Logos" to describe the "divine order".
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The idea of inherent human rights does not depend on whether people
>>>>>>>>> agree or disagree with the principles. Likewise the universality of
>>>>>>>>> those rights are not disproven by a government's power to deny them.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Upholding the idea of universal human rights gives the repressed a
place
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