From: tsm@fastmail.ca   
      
   Wilson  wrote:   
   > On 2/22/2026 10:13 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >> On Sun, 22 Feb 2026 14:35:28 -0000 (UTC), Tara    
   >> wrote:   
   >>> On Feb 22, 2026 at 9:27:27?AM EST, "Tara"  wrote:   
   >>>> On Feb 22, 2026 at 9:11:09?AM EST, "Noah Sombrero"  wrote:   
   >>>>> On Sun, 22 Feb 2026 09:00:37 +0000, Julian    
   >>>>> wrote:   
   >>>>>> On 22/02/2026 05:41, dart200 wrote:   
   >>>>>>> what would you consider pristine nature?   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> Red in tooth and claw.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Yeh, and once people have access to it, it no longer is pristine.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Most people - not all.   
   >>>   
   >>> So, best to protect Nature from 'most' people.   
   >>   
   >> It's like those ads you see for hideaway, unknown tourist   
   >> destinations.  After those ads, they aren't anymore, right?   
   >>   
   >> For instance, there are creatures who do not tolerate the presence of   
   >> humans.  I remember a prof telling us about a population of big horn   
   >> sheep in the sonoran desert.  If there are big horn sheep in an area,   
   >> and you build a road through that area, those sheep will leave.  Not   
   >> to mention whatever disturbance a road makes.  The presence of humans   
   >> alone changes the area.  How to protect it?  Prevent people from going   
   >> there.   
   > When I was in Glacier National Park 30 years ago walking a trail near   
   > Logan Pass, a Bighorn allowed me to walk right up to it. I stopped when   
   > I was about 20 feet away, but it didn't seem at all concerned as I took   
   > a great picture (pre-digital era) of it.   
      
   They’ve habituated to people due to food and learning that people aren’t   
   threatening. Sheep aren’t predators though, so maybe that has something to   
   do with it. And they’re among the species that can be domesticated.   
      
      
      
   >   
   > This isn't unusual there. Here's a photo of two rams having a status   
   > debate in a parking lot full of spectators:   
   > https://unofficialnetworks.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/Scre   
   nshot-2024-07-18-at-14.55.40.jpg   
   >   
   > Maybe the sheep in Glacier have a completely different attitude from the   
   > ones in the Sonora desert. Or maybe that story is just complete bunk and   
   > yet another example that so much of what progs believe is simply not true.   
   >   
   > Now if you'd have used the mountain lion (aka cougar, puma, or panther)   
   > as an example you'd have made a decent point. They once lived throughout   
   > the continental US but were extremely shy and didn't like to live around   
   > people.   
   >   
   > Also the Jaguar which once had a range that extended through the   
   > Appalachian mountains in the east all the way up to the great lakes, and   
   > were actually seen there only 300 years ago. They were less shy and   
   > didn't mind raiding farms for pigs, which caused people to hunt them to   
   > near extinction everywhere except the Amazon. We stopped killing them as   
   > much and now although rarely seen they've moved back into central   
   > America, Mexico and even southern Texas and Arizona.   
   >   
   > https://youtu.be/QqX2GFw7EdE   
   >   
   >   
      
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