[continued from previous message]   
      
   only solar and wind, and given the droughts many of the Hydro electric   
   dams are at reduced capacity.   
      
   SO even as NEW Solar/Wind is put into operation the Hydro is declining   
   in operational output. I like the way the GLOBAL WARMING CULT estimates   
   their sustainable power by estimating it all at peak output with 100%   
   efficiency, which would be a rare thing since the wind an rain and sun   
   all happening at the same time... is a very rare. Which means that those   
   are not all 100% all the time. They need to be forced to use real time   
   data NOT pie in the sky estimated of 100% duty cycles.   
      
   >>>> That's also assuming they last long enough to reach that *zero carbon*   
   >>>> *point of return and start producing sustainable energy* a certain   
   >>>> percentage of the products will be faulty or have problems soon after   
   >>>> being purchased and cars will have accidents and lightning and weather   
   >>>> will destroy solar and wind generation and that will all be part of the   
   >>>> CARBON neutral point of the system-wide return on investment.   
   >>>   
   >>> Why assume? Because current Fed regulations already require that   
   >>> manufacturers to warranty their EV’s to last long enough to do that.   
   >>   
   >> Which means that when they don't because of lightening to a windmill   
   >> that burns to a crisp or an EV car that's totaled in a battery FIRE and   
   >> burns down the HOUSE, suddenly all the energy to build new houses cars   
   >> and wind generators becomes a new NEGATIVE in carbon used column that   
   >> takes the replacement longer to become carbon neutral.   
   >   
   > So what? Trying to dramaticize the 1% exception does not reverse the primary   
   trend.   
      
   It is yet another cost in the price of getting to your goal, it's always   
   relevant to understand the failure in a system to know if it's an   
   acceptable system. And that failure means that you reach that tipping   
   point of actual sustainability farther down the road than you're   
   predicting and that all the recent lies about reaching some nebulous   
   goal of being over the hump and being legitimate is far from true.   
      
      
   Sustainable solar, wind and hydro and geothermal, means more geothermal   
   and hydro as an anchor for that NEW HI-TECH GRID that isn't there... so   
   the 60Hz sine wave an the cascading black outs and equipment failure   
   aren't a daily or weekly even.   
      
      
   >   
   >>>> I'd say we're looking at not getting the bulk of the EV and SOLAR/WIND   
   >>>> to being Carbon neutral for years... and years and years.   
   >>>   
   >>> Years and years in the past, because the EV marketshare of the fleet   
   isn’t even   
   >>> at 10% yet (2010), let alone at 20% (current).   
      
   That's good because the MARKET SHARE for "real" sustainable CARBON   
   NEUTRAL energy isn't 20% either... which leaves us donwn around 5%-10%   
   doesn't it? That's living in reality.  NOT living in fundamentally   
   change and hope and Unicorn/rainbow land.   
      
   >>   
   >> Which means figuring carbon-in/carbon-out to find the carbon-neutral   
   >> point in the life of an item and where it is as a running ratio would   
   >> take some math... but the point is we aren't there yet and anything on   
   >> the road or in service on the grid that is less than 5 years old isn't   
   >> likely carbon neutral yet.   
   >   
   > Again, so what?  The trends are known and the inertia of the process means   
   > that it’s not going to be “turn on a dime” instant gratification.   
      
   Trends are how you play the Stock Markets... UP/Down and then they crash   
   in a sudden collapse.  lets diversify... Don't shoot for ZERO CARBON   
   from humans using energy shoot for 25%. And then be realistic and use   
   EV's in the BIG cities where most trips are less than the distance of   
   one battery charge and you can charge them using nuclear energy from a   
   nuclear powered grid with solar wind and hydro and geothermal from near   
   the city, the MARXIST-DEMOCRATS one size fits all Marxism of Mao is a   
   failed system so why emulate it.   
      
      
   >> Things should be sold with a "real time" in   
   >> use number to represent how long it takes to claim that it's   
   >> Carbon-neutral …   
   >   
   > And of course, you’re choosing to ignore how the Status Quo of FF’s   
   > aren’t required to be sold with a “this is how much I’m making it   
   worse”.   
   >   
      
   In reverse it would mean that the efficiency of "sustainable" is the   
   inverse of the time it takes to reach CARBON NEUTRAL which means the   
   Fossil Fuel items that are produced have a rating of ZERO or near ZERO   
   doesn't it?  Since it may take 30 million years to create more fossil   
   fuel from organic matter by nature, unless you make organic crude oil by   
   a human process and then it would have a shorter *sustainable* ratio to   
   NON sustainable, than NATURALLY OCCURRING FOSSIL FUEL depending on your   
   source of energy to make the MAN MADE imitation FOSSIL FUEL.   
      
      
   >> And on the positive side, EV's and windmills have been being put into   
   >> use as more than just tests and research and development for more than 5   
   >> years, so some of the problems and failures and fixes have worked their   
   >> way into the NEW sustainable MARKET PLACE but it will be at least 5   
   >> years more before those items sold will get to zero carbon and you can   
   >> start calling them carbon-neutral. Doing the math may show that it's NOT   
   >> linear and the more you get on line the more quickly the ratio would   
   >> show the those things reaching carbon-neutral.   
   >   
   > A five year transformation would be incredibly rapid in an industry who   
   > traditionally measures its construction timelines & ROI’s in decades.   
   > But again, if you never start, you’ll never benefit from change.   
   >   
   >>   
   >> and then there's the problem of inflation and debt slowing down the   
   >> growth of the economy which will all but stop the EV sales and solar   
   >> panel sales and investment in expansion by commercial power companies.   
   >   
   > Nope.  Capitalism has already recognized the advantages and change is now   
   > underway and inevitable, regardless of your personal feelings about if   
   it’s “ready” or not.   
   >   
      
   I can't argue that Capitalism is the engine that will keep the   
   technology advancing, the question is whether you allow the   
   MARXIST-DEMOCRAT urge to mandate and force laws on us that are ONE SIZE   
   FITS ALL like the typical Marxists that represent failure and starvation   
   and poverty and death for the masses, while the few elite's at the top   
   of the food chain grow fat and spoiled until the masses have to recreate   
   the FRENCH REVOLUTION.   
      
   >   
   >> Everything will become as it did in the 1970's under Jimmy Carter, put   
   >> on a sweater and don't use energy... which undermines the idea that you   
   >> will ever get enough Solar/Wind Hydro/Thermal to get over the real hump   
   >> of *sustainable energy being able to sustain itself* , without being   
   >> built and maintained/subsidized by the fossil energy industry and making   
   >> the... the idea of sustainable a *reality which has yet to be achieved* .   
   >   
   > Only if we are catastrophically incapable of learning from our history…   
   > …and our economic neighbors… and competitors.  Your life must really   
   > suck Thor you to be so clearly pessimistic about your own future.   
      
   I was optimistic when TRUMP was in office I thought we might not crash   
   and burn and lose it all, and then Democrats stole an election and that   
   all changed and it looks like it's all headed for the toilet... we're   
   circling the bowl and it's NOT looking any better for the future, it   
   looks like this past century was about as good as it will ever get.   
   Which is really pretty sad because it want's all that great but it was   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)