From: Man@the.keyboard   
      
   On Tue, 02 Dec 2025 12:04:35 -0500, Winston   
    wrote:   
      
   >In regard to the original subject ("Can my neiighbor, whose wifi I'm   
   >using, see what I'm doing?"), I can't speak to what your particular   
   >neighbor could or is doing, but from a theoretical standpoint, the   
   >answer is Yes: some routers have the ability to do selective packet   
   >tracing, allowing forwarding to somewhere else a copy of all packets   
   >to and/or from a particular host, and they can then be recorded.   
   >   
   >The packet headers (containing the IP addresses of the hosts you   
   >connect to) will certainly be readable.   
   >   
   >If the data portion is encrypted, then, to first order, it won't be   
   >readable (which is why https, TLS, and other encryption is generally   
   >encouraged).   
   >   
   >If you're using a VPN, and if your DNS queries use the VPN, so that the   
   >only connections your host makes are to the VPN, the IP addresses in the   
   >packet headers will only be that of the VPN, not the hosts you're   
   >ultimately connecting to, making those IP addresses less informative.   
   >   
   >On to the next topic ...   
   >   
   >As a small part of an otherwise interesting article,   
   >Marian  wrote:   
   >> In the United States, using a neighbor's open Wi-Fi without permission is   
   >> generally considered unauthorized access under federal and state law. Even   
   >> if the network is unsecured, courts have treated this as potentially   
   >> illegal. Case law and statutes (like the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act)   
   >> support that "piggybacking" on someone else's Wi-Fi can be prosecuted,   
   >> though enforcement is rare unless other crimes are involved.   
   >   
   >[and much more]   
   >   
   >It'll be interesting to see if/how that means Amazon Sidewalk design   
   >and devices constitute widespread unauthorized access.   
   >   
   >Sidewalk devices use Ring doorbell and Amazon Echo devices as routers   
      
    A company called "FON" used to have routers that allowed their users   
   to link through *any* other FON router on the planet so long as that   
   user allowed the planet to use 25% of his very own home router.   
      
    The 25% password-free bandwidth was on a separate network from the   
   user's home network and theoretically the two were total strangers to   
   each other.   
      
    You could use 1/4 of my bandwidth while passing through my city if I   
   FONned-up but you couldn't use my webcam to peek into my bedrooms.   
      
    I think they've sort of died. I haven't seen a free FON-point for a   
   couple of years.   
      
   >and are allowed to use up to 500MB worth of data from each such router.   
      
    Technically, FON was unlimited use and unlimited persons could use   
   each router's loose 25%. You logged into the loose 25% with your FON   
   userid no matter where you were and it was as though you were at home.   
   Sort of.   
      
   >The owners of these devices are not allowed to see who their devices   
   >connect to (either direction).  Furthermore, Sidewalk device connections   
   >are enabled and allowed by default ("opt out", not "opt in"), so this   
   >will, in many cases, happen without the Ring/Echo owner's knowledge,   
   >understanding, or explicit consent.   
      
    So, like FON, you lose some of your bandwidth for the convenience of   
   the rest of the population. That's sort of neat, if you agree to allow   
   it and you aren't paranoid enough to suspect the possibility of them   
   hopping through the Sidewalk net to your home net.   
      
    Like FON, I suppose that means trusting the manufacturer. :)   
      
                                                                J.   
      
   >   
   > -WBE   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)