XPost: alt.comp.os.windows-11   
   From: winstonmvp@gmail.com   
      
   Jeff Barnett wrote on 1/25/2026 1:55 AM:   
   > On 1/24/2026 11:05 PM, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote:   
   >> Paul wrote on 1/24/2026 10:16 PM:   
   >>> On Sat, 1/24/2026 11:26 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:   
   >>>> On 1/24/2026 7:23 PM, Paul wrote:   
   >>>>> On Sat, 1/24/2026 8:29 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:   
   >>>>>> On 1/24/2026 5:37 PM, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote:   
   >>>>>>> Jeff Barnett wrote on 1/24/2026 12:56 PM:   
   >>>>>>>> On 1/24/2026 10:07 AM, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>> Jeff Barnett wrote on 1/24/2026 9:07 AM:   
   >>>>>>>>>> On 1/23/2026 12:44 AM, ...w¡ñ§±¤ñ wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>>>> micky wrote on 1/22/2026 4:26 PM:   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> I suppose most of the readers of these newsgroups know that   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> for a full   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> start from scratch it's required to run Restart, instead of   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> Shutdown   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> followed by starting later.  Even though I only learned this   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> a year ago   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> and even though it's a bit counter-intuitive, you all know   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> that, right,   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> (because if you're running with Fast Startup*** shutdown   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> saves the   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> kernel and reuses it, but Restart never uses Fast Startup and it   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> rebuilds the kernel, with new values if the values have   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> changed).   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> But maybe you did not know that you can get the benefit of   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> Restart and   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> still turn your machine off if you press Shift while clicking on   
   >>>>>>>>>>>> Shutdown.   How about that!!   
   >>>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> If Hibernation (and by extension, Fast Startup) is disabled   
   >>>>>>>>>>> (e.g., via powercfg -h off), the "Shutdown" button functions   
   >>>>>>>>>>> as a full, traditional shutdown - clears the system   
   >>>>>>>>>>> state(shuts down all processes) and clears temp memory and   
   >>>>>>>>>>> powers Off. Subsequent Powering on, re-initializes the o/s   
   >>>>>>>>>>>     - which, incidentally is the same results as   
   Shift-Shutdown.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>     i.e. you don't need to the keystroke combo if Hibernation   
   >>>>>>>>>>> is disabled.   
   >>>>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>>>> Restart(when Hiberation is disabled) does the exact same   
   >>>>>>>>>>> clearing but instead of shutting down, powers the device back   
   >>>>>>>>>>> on and re- initializes the o/s.   
   >>>>>>>>>> I have Hibernation set to never in my power profile. However, I   
   >>>>>>>>>> have an APC UPS that will hibernate the machine in case of an   
   >>>>>>>>>> extended power outage; in other words, the APC software is able   
   >>>>>>>>>> to work around that setting. Does this setup change anything   
   >>>>>>>>>> said in this thread so far?   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> Afaik, the UPS Hibernation feature requires enabling Windows   
   >>>>>>>>> hibernation.   
   >>>>>>>>>     i.e. When a power outage occurs, the UPS has to communicate   
   >>>>>>>>> with Windows and validate Windows hibernation state(enabled/   
   >>>>>>>>> disabled), if enabled instruct Windows to hibernate, once done   
   >>>>>>>>> the UPS provides backup battery power for the duration of its   
   >>>>>>>>> capability.   
   >>>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>>> Lacking Windows hibernation, the UPS only provides battery power   
   >>>>>>>>> for the device(and Windows) for the duration of its backup   
   >>>>>>>>> battery capability.   
   >>>>>>>>>      - no Windows hibernation   
   >>>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>>> I've not enabled hibernation (as said above) but the APC software   
   >>>>>>>> seems to be able to do it anyway. Perhaps it changes the power   
   >>>>>>>> profile when necessary. I remember one of the disk tester/   
   >>>>>>>> diagnostic packages that turned sleep off when it was called and   
   >>>>>>>> never bothered to restore it on its way out. So there is   
   >>>>>>>> certainly some way to diddle the settings.   
   >>>>>>>   
   >>>>>>> See Paul's response, that echo's my input.   
   >>>>>>>     => Hibernation needs to be enabled in Windows.   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>> I believe (from my own experience) that Paul is incorrect in this   
   >>>>>> specific case. The APC software (OS level stuff) can when it   
   >>>>>> decides it's time to shutdown because of battery drain, etc, can   
   >>>>>> arrange that hibernation works whether the user has enabled it or   
   >>>>>> not. I've noted it's happening a few times.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> I think there has to be a hiberfile (C:\hiberfil.sys) and   
   >>>>> it is typically equal in size to 50% of memory or a larger   
   >>>>> percentage. Via compression, the RAM content written out to   
   >>>>> the hiberfile is smaller than the physical size. Most sessions   
   >>>>> on Windows are quite small, so only a fraction of the reserved   
   >>>>> hiberfile space is used.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>>      powercfg /a     # check supported ACPI states.   
   >>>>>                      # Hibernation is S4. Mine is   
   disabled right now.   
   >>>>>                      # A   shutdown /h   would   
   generate an error of   
   >>>>> some sort.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>>      powercfg /h on  # Add Hibernation, then verify with the first   
   >>>>> command   
   >>>>>                      # Check for hidden file on the   
   root of C: with   
   >>>>> dir /ah in command prompt   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> There is also some procedure at startup, which may be writing   
   >>>>> something to the header of the hiberfile. The hiberfile is   
   >>>>> "invalidated"   
   >>>>> as part of startup, such that it cannot be reused immediately to   
   >>>>> restore the same session ("like it was GroundHog day").   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Otherwise, without using the hibernation feature, little in the   
   >>>>> way of wear, happens because of the existence of the hiberfile.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> If you were installing the APC software, it is possible there is   
   >>>>> sufficient elevation at install time, for the APC software to be   
   >>>>> using powercfg and switching the hiberfile on and reserving the   
   >>>>> necessary space.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Once the hiberfile exists, the normal set of system commands   
   >>>>> should work, to generate a hiberfile. The command from the UPS   
   >>>>> should be terse -- it isn't always a super-intelligent processing   
   >>>>> thing. Any application loaded into the host OS, has to do the   
   >>>>> more intelligent part. The UPS should not be sending this   
   >>>>> command, as written. That would be an exploit waiting to happen.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>>      shutdown /h   
   >>>> Paul, the power plan/profile that I've selected specifies "never" for   
   >>>> hibernate. However, there is a ~27GB hiberfil.sys for my 64GB memory   
   >>>> on the C disk. I presume that the APC software ensures that such a   
   >>>> file exists and knows how to flip bits in the header to inform the   
   >>>> BIOS that this is a hibernate. There was no hiberfil.sys with the   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)