XPost: can.talk.guns, alt.guns, alt.rec.guns   
   XPost: talk.politics.guns   
   From: heekster@iwxt.net   
      
   On Sat, 15 Sep 2007 12:43:24 GMT, "Scout"   
    wrote:   
      
   >   
   >"Leif"  wrote in message   
   >news:1189835328.118600.105910@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com...   
   >> On Sep 14, 4:59 am, "Topp@Work"  wrote:   
   >>> "Leif"  wrote in message   
   >>>   
   >>> news:1189744550.229127.155690@22g2000hsm.googlegroups.com...   
   >>>   
   >>> > Leif speaking:  Those who look upon "the people" of the 2nd amendment   
   >>> > as being the same as those in the 4th are simply wrong.  The people of   
   >>> > the 4th amendment is made up of the general public.  The people of the   
   >>> > 2nd amendment consists only of those who are capable of bearing arms.   
   >>> > In the exclusively military context of the Second Amendment, the   
   >>> > people who bore arms were those who capable of rendering military   
   >>> > service.   
   >>>   
   >>> Really:   
   >>>   
   >>> "Arms in the hands of citizens (may) be used at individual   
   >>> discretion...in private self defense..."   
   >>> -John Adams, A defense of the Constitutions of the Government of the   
   >>>  USA, 471 (1788)   
   >>>   
   >>> "...the people have a right to keep and bear arms."   
   >>> -Patrick Henry and George Mason, Elliot, Debates at 185   
   >>>   
   >>> "The right of the people to keep and bear...arms shall not be   
   >>> infringed.  A well regulated militia, composed of the people, trained   
   >>> to arms, is the best and most natural defense of a free country..."   
   >>> -James Madison, I Annals of Congress 434 (June 8, 1789)   
   >>>   
   >>> "A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people   
   >>> themselves...and include all men capable of bearing arms."   
   >>> -Richard Henry Lee, Additional Letters from the Federal Farmer (1788)   
   >>>  at 169   
   >>>   
   >>> "The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at   
   >>> least 17 years of age..."   
   >>> -Title 10, Section 311 of the U.S. Code   
   >>>   
   >>> GUESS YER WRONG.   
   >>>   
   >>> > Well regulated state militias, in the latter part of 18th   
   >>> > Century America, consisted of nonexempt men falling within the age   
   >>> > limits established under state law for militia service.   Militarily   
   >>> > speaking, they were "the people."  Taken together, they were a  set of   
   >>> > persons a good deal different from that of the general public of the   
   >>> > 4th Amendment.   
   >>>   
   >>> So If "The people" doesn't apply to all the amendments as intended...YOU   
   >>> have no   
   >>> right to share your moronic ideas here...Go away now, before we form a   
   >>> Bureau   
   >>> of Speech and require background checks for each word you speak.   
   >>>   
   >>> > Contrary to what you say, if the Framers had intended the Second   
   >>> > Amendment as protection for personal gun rights for individuals, they   
   >>> > would have said so.  "Individual" is a word that appears nowhere in   
   >>> > the amendment.  On the other hand, not only does the word "militia"   
   >>> > play an important part, but it is really what the amendment is all   
   >>> > about.   
   >>>   
   >>> Really:   
   >>> "The people are not to be disarmed of their weapons.  They are left in   
   >>> full possession of them."   
   >>> -Zachariah Johnson, 3 Elliot, Debates at 646   
   >>>   
   >>> "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms."   
   >>> -Thomas Jefferson, Proposal Virginia Constitution, 1 T. Jefferson   
   >>> Papers, 334 (C.J. Boyd, Ed., 1950)   
   >>>   
   >>> "The right of the people to keep and bear...arms shall not be   
   >>> infringed.  A well regulated militia, composed of the people, trained   
   >>> to arms, is the best and most natural defense of a free country..."   
   >>> -James Madison, I Annals of Congress 434 (June 8, 1789)   
   >>>   
   >>> "The Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to   
   >>> prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens,   
   >>> from keeping their own arms."   
   >>> -Samuel Adams, debates & Proceedings in the Convention of the   
   >>>  Commonwealth of Massachusetts, 86-87   
   >>>   
   >>> GUESS YER WRONG AGAIN   
   >>   
   >>   
   >> Leif speaking:  Your standard Guns Unlimited quotes   
   >   
   >So anytime you refer to "Guns Unlimited" what you really mean is "Founding   
   >Fathers"?   
   >   
   >   
   "leif" thinks if you tell a lie often enough, it becomes the truth.   
      
   No way in hell is this SOB a WWII vet.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)