XPost: uk.politics.misc, uk.politics.parliament, alt.politics.british   
   XPost: uk.media, uk.legal   
   From: banana@REMOVE_THIS.borve.demon.co.uk   
      
   In article ,   
   turtill@hotmail.com writes   
      
   >On Mon, 6 Mar 2006 00:38:36 +0000, banana   
   > wrote:   
   >   
   >>In article ,   
   >>turtill@hotmail.com writes   
   >>   
   >>>On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 23:28:13 +0000, banana   
   >>> wrote:   
   >>>   
   >>>>In article <7rfm02pv6mcv777jbscp5p1snl8omida2q@4ax.com>,   
   >>>>turtill@hotmail.com writes   
   >>>>   
   >>>>>On Sun, 5 Mar 2006 19:22:26 +0000, banana   
   >>>>> wrote:   
   >>>   
   >>>>>>I wonder whether Pete has ever been near a council house? Doesn't sound   
   >>>>>>like it.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>>I live in a former council house on a council estate.   
   >>>>   
   >>>>OK - but why were you so derogatory about 'council house wives'? The   
   >>>>idea that most married female council tenants are a) stupid and b)   
   >>>>battered is insulting, ignorant rubbish. It's the sort of thing right   
   >>>>wing middle class idiots come out with, who haven't ever met anyone in   
   >>>>the group that they so despise. You should know better!   
   >>>   
   >>>No 'I' live on a council estate and have done for 45 years and I know   
   >>>what I am talking about. I live with it. I see it and I here of it   
   >>>too.   
   >>   
   >>For about half my life I lived on council estates too. On one (I   
   >>wouldn't generalise) the anti-social arseholes were unfortunately   
   >>getting more clout but there was still a tremendous amount of solidarity   
   >>among the decent people who were the vast majority. The estate contained   
   >>only flats, no houses (the latter are usually more saleable by those who   
   >>have bought them), and the few (2% of people?) who had bought leaseholds   
   >>from the council tended to be snobs, which was doubtless played on by   
   >>the bureaucrats and bankers who shafted the poor souls left, right, and   
   >>centre. By now the service charge is probably more than the rent, and   
   >>the flats are probably unsaleable at any price, given the fact (and I   
   >>mean fact) of 'reverse windfalls', i.e. bills for very large amounts of   
   >>money when the landlord decides e.g. the windows or roof need replacing.   
   >>I think it is true to say that most of those who bought leaseholds on   
   >>council flats didn't fully understand the risks involved. The same is   
   >>not true of those who bought council houses, which are (usually) a   
   >>different ball game. For the record, I am opposed to the sale of council   
   >>houses and flats.   
   >>   
   >>If you think most married female council tenants are a) stupid and b)   
   >>battered, you need to get out some more.   
   >   
   >I didn't say 'most'.   
      
   You implied it, but if you want to back-track that'd be good. You said:   
      
      
   ***BEGIN EXTRACT***   
      
   >> It seems she had eccentric financial practises too. She signed all the   
   >> mortgage agreements and now says she knows nothing of her husbands   
   >> dealings. It just doesn't wash. She is not a council house wife doing   
   >> what she is told or face a black eye. She is a highly educated woman   
   >> who knows what a mortgage agreement looks like and what it means too.   
   >> Is she really expecting the world to believe she is some poor ignorant   
   >> woman dominated by her husband and yet she is a cabinet minister who   
   >> has just separated from this man who controls her. Nah it has got to   
   >> be something juicy in tomorrows newspapers.   
      
   ***END EXTRACT***   
      
   >>Why do you put 'I' in quotes?   
   >   
   >Because you obviously do not live on a council estate.   
      
   I assume this means you did it for emphasis. I don't live on a council   
   estate. I did, however, live on council estates for half my life.   
   Council estates differ quite a lot from one to the other. If you think   
   something I've said is ill-informed, why not say what it is?   
      
   I'll tell you something - when living on council estates I never once   
   heard anyone use the phrase 'council house wife'. It's the sort of   
   phrase I associate with vile right-wing haters of the poor who use   
   phrases such as 'pram face', 'pikey', and 'chav scum'.   
      
   --   
   banana     "The thing I hate about you, Rowntree, is the way you   
               give Coca-Cola to your scum, and your best teddy-bear to   
               Oxfam, and expect us to lick your frigid fingers for the   
               rest of your frigid life." (Mick Travis, 'If...', 1968)   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)