XPost: sci.psychology.psychotherapy, alt.consciousness, talk.origins   
   From: sfct@aol.com   
      
   sweetnes_n_light@yahoo.com wrote:   
   >   
   > >But the need for testing with positive bonding between   
   > >people has yet to be done. Randi? Is he the one who   
   > >changes the standards when h is ready to lose his money?   
   > >I don't know much about him.   
   >   
   > If you don't know much about him, why are you slandering him? I am   
   > unaware of any case where he "changed his standards", although there   
   > are many people on the internet who keep repeating it.   
   >   
   > The deal is very simple. You show some supernatural ability, you get a   
   > million bucks. It is a very good deal for Randi, too - a piece of   
   > evidence of any paranormal phenomenon would be the news of the   
   > century, and it is well worth a million bucks just to be involved in   
   > the original experiment that showed it to the world. He *wants* to   
   > give the money away, the opportunity to do so is worth far more then   
   > the cash.   
   >   
   > Alas, nobody so far has demonstrated him/herself capable of   
   > demonstrating *any* paranormal phenomenon. It mirrors the "science" of   
   > parapsychology: after a century of research, they have no results.   
   >   
   > Do correct me if I am wrong about anything here.   
   >   
   > >I'm more interested in the testing they conducted   
   > >at Princeton.   
   >   
   > ? Details? The only study of ESP at Princeton I am aware of was the   
   > one that ended with complete embarassment when the initial "ESP   
   > successes" turned out to be cheap magical tricks and sleight-of-hand.   
   >   
   > >And how some former CIA agents claim they were   
   > >trained to remote view.   
   >   
   > Yes, they were trained. But the training failed, and none of them was   
   > ever able to "remote view" anything. Which, again, is the reason the   
   > whole thing was discontinued (after first wasting $20M). CIA   
   > eventually admitted that "no useful information" was ever produced by   
   > the project.   
   >   
   > Some of the people involved went on to tell tall stories on the   
   > internet, occasionally making absurdly wrong "predictions" and   
   > "viewings" to prove their abilities.   
   >   
   > Do you have a different story? Any evidence for remote viewing?   
   >   
   > >But cognitive science, the nature of information,   
   > >how SPACE might communicate information, the nature   
   > >of awareness, the nature of perception, oh   
   > >pleaseeeeeeeeee keep the man home.   
   >   
   > Why?   
   >   
   > As you say, he can spot hustlers. Scientists can be taken in by   
   > con-men as easily as anyone else. So bring Randy to look for   
   > tricksters, and bring scientists to check for scientific validity. If   
   > someone has a genuine ability, Randi's presence won't affect it at   
   > all.   
   >   
   > Also, your idea of cognitive science seems to be somewhat peculiar.   
   > There are some things known (neuroscience is making huge advances),   
   > but there is a lot more that is not known. However, at this point and   
   > as far as I am aware of, there is zero evidence for "space   
   > communcating information", or any type of extrasensory perception   
   > (which seems to be what you're talking about here). Everyone who ever   
   > claimed to have such an ability either refuses to be take even the   
   > simplest tests, or takes the tests and fails them miserably.   
   >   
   > Again, if you have *any* evidence of *any* extrasensory or paranormal   
   > ability, please do tell. I am most interested in hearing it.   
   >   
   > M.   
      
      
      
   Boy, when you're wrong you're wrong.   
      
      
   One of the biggest problems in physics is the non-local problem. Its   
   finally been proved, what Einstein called 'spooky action at a distance'   
   that small particles  do exchange infromation faster than the speed of   
   light. The upper limit to how fast information should be able to be   
   exchanged in the physical universe. They know somehow Space is   
   responsible, but they can't get to the answer.   
      
   I see Space as a set of relationships, like Eisntein did. But I go   
   further. I see it as a border between the physical, but non-corporeal,   
   and the metapphysical. Such as ideas, relationships, patterns, spirit,   
   even music if you like.   
      
   Also, this is crap because its wrong. 'Everyone who ever claimed to have   
   such an ability either refuses to be take even the simplest tests, or   
   takes the tests and fails them miserably.'   
      
      
   Princeton did a good job in finding some proof for it. And the miltary   
   actually learned how to use remote viewing for spy missions. Before you   
   jump into your simple minded conclusions, try researching the topic a   
   bit better. You sound very high school. Very naive. I was just like you   
   once. My NDE started me on a road to change, and the questioning of so   
   called experts. The more I learned, thought, the more I realized what   
   some knew, and how far others would go to hide the truth. There is a lot   
   of hidden politics involved in the field.   
      
   When I was naive, my thinking was simple. First I doubted, smug in my   
   college science training. Smug in what I thought I knew. And the world   
   of science in my mind was mostly divorced from political reality. Even   
   if ESP could be proven to be true then wow...what does it mean about the   
   nature of information, and the way our minds gather information? Can   
   information travel back in time? If so, then is the future set? Or   
   what.....blah blah blah. Simple minded because the political   
   implications were sort of there in my mind, but hazy, didn't focus on   
   what others would worry about.   
      
   Like, if the public learns to harness this ability how will they keep   
   military secrets? Attack plans? Or real public policies towards certain   
   groups behind closed doors, not the fake face they put on it to win   
   votes. What if the public catches on to the fact both parties in America   
   really are controlled from a distance by the same rich groups? Or that   
   there are hidden policies to change the types of people who occupy   
   America over the next 200 hundred years. Because those in power behind   
   closed doors actually do believe in average differences between racial   
   groups. Or lets get wilder. Some know the big secret. God is actually a   
   hidden composite mind in Mankind of all the left brains in Mankind. His   
   rival, what we normally called Satan, is another group mind of right   
   brains.   
   As your brain cells add their activities up to one overall   
   consciousness, YOU. They also add up to something greater then   
   ourselves, but still, nevertheless, exist within Mankind. And they kept   
   themselves and their war to control mankind's destiny hidden from people   
   as individuals, except for a few key people.   
      
   God, controls the left brain, thus the right side of our bodies because   
   the left brain controls the right side of our bodies. Left brain handles   
   language.   
      
   Thus, God, "my glorious right hand."   
      
        Jesus, "I shall stand of the right side of God's throne."   
      
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)