From: Be@Here.Now   
      
   On Thu, 22 Sep 2005 17:51:42 GMT, Alistair@nothere.com wrote:   
      
      
   >No, an NDE is evidence that the person has experienced SOMETHING that   
   >may or may not be associated with life after death. The two are not   
   >necessairly connected.   
   >   
      
   A NDE, by definition, is associated with death.  If it is not   
   associated with death it called an Out of body experience.  It's   
   interesting the OBE are far more common than NDE.  Personally,I have   
   had several and I know at least 20 people who have had the same   
   experience.   
      
      
   >But every culture believing in somethign does not make it a fact (my   
   >father used to say, "None of us is as stupid as all of us." ).   
   >We used to believe all sorts of thing that we have since found to be   
   >false. Perhaps belief in God and in an afterlife is just another one   
   >of those self-delusions just waiting to fade into history.   
   >   
      
   Statistics do not make anything a fact; however, a pattern of anything   
   occurring 100% of the time is statistically very significant.  It's   
   funny who people reject scientific data when it doesn't fit there   
   world view.  Materialism has become a fundamentalist dogma that   
   rejects science just as much as religious fundamentalist dogma.  These   
   statistics don't prove anything, but it is amazing consistency.   
      
      
   >Actually it does not. To follow your arguement -   
   >1. All matter is energy (can we agree to state that one of the states   
   >of energy is matter?)   
   >2. Energy/Matter can be considered "potential")   
   >3. Energy Matter may be conscious in some states.   
   >   
   >All that "follows" is - if 3 is TRUE, then sometimes energy/matter may   
   >not be conscious in some states. Therefore some energy/matter may or   
   >may not be potential (impotent-ial? , sorry, I couldn't help   
   >it).   
   >   
   >Nothing in that logic flow states that the basis of ALL consciousness   
   >is potential....just tryiing to keep the discussion honest.   
   >   
      
   After all, matter is just slow energy stuck together, and energy is   
   just that which effects matter or other energy.   
      
   As to #3, current scientific theory is that all is this energy/matter   
   stuff and this stuff directly reacts to consciousness.  When viewed   
   this stuff acts as a particle, when not view it acts as a wave.  We   
   are just starting to understand this interrelation.   
      
   In addition, Bell's theorem seems to imply that there is no reality   
   separate from consciousness.  And Enstiem's relativity mathematically   
   states that at the speed of light time stops and becomes a singular   
   "Now" where all is happening at once, and space expands infinitely to   
   a non-local, singular "Here".   
   (so "Be Here Now" is consciousness at the speed of light, lol)   
      
   I just love this physics stuff!   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)