From: vagans@inanna.eanna.net   
      
   Johnny Fusion =11811=  wrote:   
   > Sourcerer  wrote:   
   > : Johnny Fusion =11811=  wrote:   
   > :> Sourcerer  wrote:   
   > :> : Johnny Fusion =11811=  wrote:   
   > :   
      
      
      
   > : The datapoint to keep front and center is that the economy depends on   
   > : the internet -- and so does the social power. That's a major difference   
   > : between what it was like in the early 90s and now. I'm not disagreeing   
   > : with the picture you've drawn in this thread. It's just that it seems to   
   > : me you are a lot more cheerful about it than I am 8-)   
   >   
   > I guess I am a utopian cyberpunk and not a dystopian one.  I see   
   > technology in general and computers in specific as an empowering, enabling   
   > thing.   
      
   I do, too. I point out, though, that it empowers and enables all sorts,   
   some of them very much more powerful than you or I and with agendas   
   quite different from our own. What I am saying is that due to the crisis   
   that began in the credit markets and due to the position in the economy   
   the internet has achieved, it is inevitable that they will concentrate   
   their attention on the internet. The result of that 'attention' must   
   effect a major change on the current circumstances of being online.   
      
   Despite all the initiatives and legislation, the internet remains a   
   "frontier" and somewhat lawless...that Night City quality is still here.   
   But as you put it, the internet, cyberspace, cyberpunk has been   
   mainstreamed. I am looking at the consequences of that. Since the   
   internet is economically necessary, they gotta clean up Dodge and make   
   it safe for honest citizens to do their jobs. How they will go about   
   attempting it, I find interesting. Whether they will succeed, I cannot   
   guess.   
      
   > I also have kind of a metaphysical explanation about networks and   
   > our species.  The Interent, like all networks are not there to make money,   
   > hold up the economy or serve as a medium for social or political power.   
   > The network is not even there to push bits back and forth.  Humanity   
   > builds networks to connect individuals, one to another.  We are the   
   > ultimate social animal, always seeking a connection to those around us.   
   > These connections can be phyiscal, or conducted through a medium where the   
   > more potent connection occurs, the meeting of minds. These mind to mind   
   > connections are facilitated by data and knowledge.   
      
   And humanity most often trades when they meet, all 7 billion of us. Not   
   just now, but from the beginning. The economy is at bottom the household   
   budget, food on the table for the kids, the hope of a decent education,   
   and a good job. That's what stresses the system, those desires, becuase   
   no system of economy or governance has yet delivered it. We are about to   
   find out, I think, whether global networks are capable of it. If not,   
   then we'll have to come up with something else.   
      
   > < "cybercriminal" would I have even noticed if I were not in this newsgroup   
   > again?>>   
      
   'cyber' is back. Why I'm back, too.   
      
      
   --   
     (__)    Sourcerer   
    /(<>)\ O|O|O|O||O||O   
     \../  |OO|||O|||O||   Mirroring the shadows of futurity   
      ||   OO|||OO||O||O   since 1993   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)