From: trminlxGARBAGE@bitstreamnet.com   
      
   In article <51f64020.0311070243.62121272@posting.google.com>,   
    u01mzb@abdn.ac.uk (FixinDixon) wrote:   
      
   > ghost   
   >   
   > >   
   > > So, FixinDixon, tell us what this movement is supposed to be and we'll   
   > > tell you if we want to join. Either way we're not leaving this newsgroup.   
   >   
   > I don't presume to tell you what the movement is or was.  I wasn't   
   > there to experience it, and reading about it isn't as helpful as you   
   > might think.  My original question was "what is the cyberpunk   
   > subculture?" and, as far as I'm aware, it's everyone posting on this   
   > board, plus those who would do if they had anything to say or knew of   
   > it's existence.  It's not formalised, it's not cohesive and it's only   
   > form of extensive communication with itself is via the web.   
   >   
   > The notion 'cyberpunk' originally describes a bunch of disaffected   
   > teens who do a little hacking to improve their world.  It was taken on   
   > board by part of the sf movement and really blew up past that when R.   
   > Talsorian used it as the title for their game (don't believe me?   
   > Google 'cyberpunk'.  You'll get more Talsorain related links than sf   
   > links, guaranteed).   
      
   Actually no. Cyberpunk NEVER described a bunch of disaffected teens who   
   did a little hacking to improve their world.   
      
   Cyberpunk always was a subgenre of SF and was invented solely to give   
   that subgenre a marketing name. Shirley may have been a punk rocker but   
   he was not a "Cyberpunk", neither was Gibson or Sterling. They didn't   
   have look at a bunch of kids somewhere and go "Hey, let's write about   
   them" They wanted to take SF and spin it on it's head something fierce -   
   and they did.   
      
   And we know all about R. Talsorian, I remeber when it came out, sure I   
   was a wee little one but I've been a gamer for most of the my life. And   
   that company did a Very Cyberpunk Thing (tm) and Capitalized on a brand   
   name to make an OK gaming system to simulate the works of the Authors   
   who coined the term to describe their books.   
      
   I'm not sure exactly when Cyberpunk became a word, and I haven't the   
   time this moment to go find it, but I know for a fact it didn't exist   
   before Neuromancer.   
      
   And if you're talking Notion Of Cyberpunk then we have argued that it   
   can go all the way back to Leonardo Da Vinci, or probably all the way   
   back to the guy who made a wheel and went "Hell yeah." Notion's mean   
   nothing really, to vague to work with.   
      
   > Currently, I believe the movement is in a coma.  The body (rock/goth   
   > bands, techies, hackers etc) are still operating in isolation, but the   
   > mind isn't quite switched on...there are no signals being sent out to   
   > the organs, there are none being sent back.  And you can't join a   
   > movement you are already part of.   
   >   
   > I don't want you to leave the board.  Why should I?  You guys seem to   
   > know what you're talking about and what you can teach me would be   
   > helpful.   
      
   I'm part of a movement? oh dear.   
      
      
   ghost   
   ~/~ Sometimes I forget to pray I'll make it through this fucking day ~/~   
               www.accanthology.com ~/~ www.bitstreamnet.com   
                      take out the GARBAGE to email.   
      
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