XPost: alt.buddha.short.fat.guy, alt.philosophy.taoism, alt.supp   
   rt.schizophrenia   
   From: ansaman@gmail.com   
      
   On 7/9/2021 8:18 AM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   > On Fri, 9 Jul 2021 06:26:44 -0400, ansaman  wrote:   
   >   
   >> On 7/8/2021 11:44 PM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>> On Thu, 8 Jul 2021 23:17:18 -0400, ansaman  wrote:   
   >>>   
   >>>> On 7/8/2021 6:34 PM, Noah Sombrero wrote:   
   >>>>> As a matter of fact.  Civilization is an unnatural act.  That doesn't   
   >>>>> mean that humans will stop trying to make it work.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> What makes it an unnatural act? Are you saying that   
   >>>> man is not a natural phenomena? What do you base that on?   
   >>>   
   >>> The natural thing was that humans would be hunter gatherers.   
   >>> Since leaving that behind, lots of other unnatural objections to   
   >>> nature's way have come along, like wanting to eat but refusing to be   
   >>> eaten (as much as possible).   
   >>   
   >> That is the right of the apex predator, totally natural. Man   
   >> is the ultimate apex predator.   
   >   
   > Not when he is living in his natural role as hunter gatherer.  Also,   
   > mosquitoes need to eat too.  Diseases are organisms that need to eat.   
   > The only time an animal kills another naturally is to eat.   
      
   That is absolutely untrue. Not even close to being true. Lions kill   
   cubs of their harem's previous mates. Prairie dogs hunt down and kill   
   ground squirrels.   
      
   >   
   > Humans are dangerous animals, but there are others far better equipped   
   > to be predators.  Humans are omnivores, not lions who must hunt.   
      
   This sounds dangerously close to a values judgement rather   
   than a scientific judgement. The record shows that humans   
   are far more adept at killing than lions and indeed they enslave   
   animals to kill at their leisure.   
      
   >   
   > Humans in groups can kill large herbivores like buffalos with pointy   
   > sticks, but it is a dangerous undertaking.  Humans were not meant be   
   > able to stand a distance away and kill buffalo with guns.   
      
   You obviously have not heard of the bow and arrow that has been   
   to stand a distance away and take down large prey. In fact, one of   
   humans most effective means of predation is the run down. We pursue   
   far faster animals for such a long time that they fall over from   
   exhaustion.   
      
      
   > Meanwhile ecological systems, where the worm eats dead things in the   
   > soil, birds eat the worms, cats eat the birds, cats die and feed the   
   > worms, and everything that lives is in balance with everything else in   
   > an endless cycle, are going away.  Humans don't like that, it is   
   > messy.  Humans simply want to be the only ones here except for dog and   
   > cat pets, maybe.  No diseases, no death, forever.  It is natural to   
   > want that, but not to actually be able to do it.   
      
   I guess you are something other than human. You get to declare   
   what is natural even if not based on anything other than   
   your value system and you point the finger as if you are not   
   human, too. I got bad news for you... there is no such thing   
   as an individual human, you are part of the whole and its   
   aggregate behavior.   
      
      
   --   
   **The AnsaMan**   
      
   In a recent self-evaluation:   
   "One of the greatest minds   
   produced since the invention   
   of the electric nose picker!"   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)