XPost: alt.support.depression, alt.support.schizophrenia, alt.bu   
   dha.short.fat.guy   
   XPost: alt.philosophy.taoism   
   From: slider@anashram.com   
      
   On Tue, 13 Aug 2024 22:47:40 +0100, Julian  wrote:   
      
   > On 13/08/2024 22:37, one wrote:   
   >> slider wrote:   
   >>> one wrote:   
   >>>> slider wrote:   
   >>>>> one wrote:   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>>> When winners exist, losers exist   
   >>>>>> which sounds kinda like a game.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> ### - debating isn't a game,   
   >>>>   
   >>>> If, for you, it isn't or   
   >>>> by definition it isn't, then,   
   >>>> it might be semantics or   
   >>>> simply how you see.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> The debate that is a debate   
   >>>> might be great or simply for fun, imo.   
   >>>   
   >>> ### - that movie is based on a true story,   
   >>  Okay.   
   >>   
   >>> it actually happened,   
   >>  Okay.   
   >>   
   >>> a lowly   
   >>> black college beat white harvard university in a debate about what the   
   >>> definition of morality is and is not,   
   >>  What is, what was, is and was.   
   >>  People used to, own, people, naturally.   
   >> Now-a-daze people, own, other animals and   
   >> apparently, on average may deem it, okay.   
   >>  Fish in tanks, birds in cages, dogs on leashes   
   >> cats kept in houses and horses whipped,   
   >> raced and who dares to say right is   
   >> wrong and rungs ring a bell eh.   
   >>   
   >>> that regardless of everything being   
   >>> against them in a white man's world   
   >>  Stereotype noted.   
   >>   
   >>> the higher principles won the day and   
   >>> the so-called white version of morality lost...   
   >>  Not sure about the topic at this point.   
   >>   
   >>> much of this later   
   >>> contributing to the civil rights movement that argues everyone is   
   >>> deserving of good/fair treatment and not just a privileged few...   
   >>  Animal rights. Children's rights. Women's rights.   
   >>  When right exists, everyone knows, wrong emerges.   
   >>  The Tao Te Ching, Chapter 2, could apply.   
   >>   
   >>> iow: this is an example of how human knowledge advances on a daily   
   >>> basis   
   >>> in the daily waking world, and it applies to both nations and to   
   >>> individuals...   
   >>  Teh struggles continue. Teh, aka Te/De,   
   >> at times translated as Virtue, Power, may   
   >> be viewed as emerging after the Way is lost.   
   >>   
   >>>>> it's an intelligent way of getting at the   
   >>>>> truth of an issue, a win-win scenario for both sides because everyone   
   >>>>> comes out the better for it even if they lose the debate,   
   >>>>   
   >>>> To surrender to win occurs at times.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> To let go and allow to be. A question   
   >>>> emerges regarding higher powers or a   
   >>>> Higher Power if there is a singularity.   
   >>>   
   >>> ### - on the human stage just letting things be results in the strong   
   >>> ruling the weak and the law of 'fist' (as in might is right etc) ruling   
   >>> the world, that being exactly what the nazi's believed in... and if the   
   >>> world hadn't gotten together and opposed them we'd all be speaking   
   >>> german   
   >>> now and going to military schools!   
   >>  The world sounds kinda like a thing. Who your, we, is,   
   >> who would be speaking German if not some other language   
   >> might be a kind of a sort of a mental noun-thing. Ore knots.   
   >>   
   >>> e.g., you mention the tao fairly often as being a narrative   
   >>  Tao is a word.   
   >> I wouldn't say Tao is a narrative.   
   >>   
   >>> you like/are attracted to?   
   >>  The newsgroup, alt.philosophy.taoism   
   >> is the group from which one is posting. One being   
   >> me of all beings as wells well and dwellings vary.   
   >>   
   >>> (nada wrong with that) but under the nazis anything like   
   >>> that would have been banned and eventually eradicated   
   >>>   
   >>> that struggle is still continuing btw...   
   >>  Prior to reading how it still remains unstill instills.   
   >>  To have a cause at times is able to motivate people.   
   >>   
   >>>>> the main thing   
   >>>>> is the argument has evolved some, and even if nothing definitive is   
   >>>>> arrived at, at least one argument (the losing one) has been dismissed   
   >>>>> from   
   >>>>> the equation no matter how much appeal (emotional or otherwise) it   
   >>>>> might   
   >>>>> have previously had... and overall that's an advance see?   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Given various presumptions, yes.   
   >>>> Science and mathematics may use such a way.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Psychology might depend more on a society   
   >>>> in terms of what is defined as well or ill.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Debates about what is right and/or wrong   
   >>>> might change over time, reverse, modified, etc.   
   >>>   
   >>> ### - doesn't matter what culture you come from, some things are   
   >>> universal   
   >>> like don't do any harm, or don't be a low life...   
   >>  If such a paradigm is your, universal,   
   >> then, t'hats your hat, flag and/or struggle   
   >> unless it isn't a struggle.   
   >>  To be content could be a Taoist mode.   
   >>  Teh, De, Te, emerges after Tao, aka Dao is lost.   
   >>   
   >>>>> both sides get a   
   >>>>> win regardless of the outcome because knowledge has been advanced a   
   >>>>> fraction...   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Seeing as how you appear to see debate happening,   
   >>>> thus far, in this thread, what new knowedge have you seen?   
   >>>   
   >>> ### - not much, yet (smile...) there's a certain inertia that has to be   
   >>> overcome/resisted first as people are sticklers for what they know, or   
   >>> think/believe they know, so being opened minded has to come first   
   >>> before   
   >>> anything new can enter in (ref. old zen story about needing to first   
   >>> empty   
   >>> one's cup)   
   >>  Okay.   
   >>   
   >>> i mean, i look around here and everyone's cups are already filled to   
   >>> overflowing, there's no room for anything more or different, people   
   >>> don't   
   >>> like/resent anything 'different', they like to feel that they've gots   
   >>> it   
   >>> all nailed down already...   
   >>  I don't know about, everyone. Nor everyone's cup   
   >> being as you say it appears to you to be.   
   >>  You appear to have a projection screen projecting screens   
   >> that screen what apears to you to be, stereotyping.   
   >>   
   >>>>> there's a very nice movie about it that explains the above in detail   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> just cut through all the hollywood-esq bs added to sell movies, and   
   >>>>> at   
   >>>>> the   
   >>>>> heart of it there's human awareness, discipline & advancement...   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> https://ok.ru/video/2387686132251   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Website has something about cookies being required.   
   >>>>   
   >>>>> (an important movie)   
   >>>>   
   >>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Debaters   
   >>>>   
   >>>> No idea how that relates to WILD nor Christ   
   >>>> or cosmic consciousness, mental illness, healing   
   >>>> the world or people who live on a surface.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> Some people see the world as in trouble,   
   >>>> the end is near, paranoia may be their mode.   
   >>>> Fear might be a driving energy for them.   
   >>>   
   >>> ### - the tibetan buddhists have a nice story/myth they circulate, it's   
   >>> about when a 3rd of the world has actually 'reached' enlightenment, and   
   >>> another 3rd is actually on a genuine road 'to' enlightenment, then   
   >>> something wonderful will occur and the last 3rd - the hardest/most   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
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