[continued from previous message]   
      
   we would’ve done that. You can decide. But Russia didn’t do it. They   
   moved in and supported the Eastern sections, mostly Russia oriented   
   population, mixed population, and they moved to take Crimea for   
   reasons that every strategic analyst understands. You want to go back   
   to Chas Freeman? Yeah. He just described it. Every Western analyst   
   understands it. Crimea, which incidentally is very pro Russian and   
   accepted the annexation, Crimea is the base for the only Russian warm   
   water port. They’re not like the United States.   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: But it was Ukrainian territory, Noam.   
      
   Noam Chomsky: Is what?   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: It was Ukrainian territory.   
      
   Noam Chomsky: What?   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: Crimea, it was Ukrainian territory from 1954 on.   
      
   Noam Chomsky: Had been recently handed over to Ukraine, traditionally   
   it had been Russian territory.   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: Right.   
      
   Noam Chomsky: It was the home… I’m not justifying it, I’m giving the   
   explanation that’s given by every US strategic analyst and high-level   
   diplomat. Russia had its only warm water ports, including Naval bases,   
   in Crimea. They were being immediately threatened by the pro US   
   government that took power with direct US involvement and was   
   beginning to move towards joining, slowly, into preliminary moves   
   towards NATO. So yes, Russia moved in for, you can say it was wrong,   
   fine, but don’t say it was not understandable.   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: No, I hear you loud and clear. But as a leftist,   
   I’m not thinking about power politics or great power politics, I’m   
   thinking about issues of sovereignty, self-determination. Just like   
   when Reagan claimed that the Sandinista victory put the Sandinistas   
   within driving distance of the Texas border, we just ridiculed that   
   position.   
      
   But let me just say this, Noam, because we have five minutes and I   
   know you have another interview and I wanted to give you a minute   
   before you went to your other interview. And so I wanted to thank you.   
   I wanted to ask you a final quick question, which is that there are   
   many people in the US left that seem to feel that there’s nothing that   
   we can do about Putin’s influence one way or another, and that we   
   should not even try. Do you have recommendations on how we in the   
   United States, particularly the left and progressives, should be   
   looking at what to do?   
      
   Noam Chomsky: First of all, as leftists, we should be opposed to all   
   imperialism, should be opposed to overthrowing governments, to   
   aggression and violence. And as human beings who are sensible and   
   moral, we should concentrate our attention, energy, and activism on   
   what we can do. Happens overwhelmingly to be the actions of our own   
   government, which happens to be the leader in the world. World   
   champion by far in opposing sovereignty, in aggression, in violence,   
   and interference, in terrorism and so on. We should oppose Russian   
   imitation of our actions. What can we do about it? Well, I think it’s   
   very clear. There are two options. The ones I mentioned before.   
      
   One option is one we’re adopting. Fight to the last Ukrainian, to   
   quote Ambassador Freeman again. And ensure that the Russians out   
   there, that Putin and his circle are backed up against the wall, no   
   exit, no way out, therefore they’ll have the basic option of   
   destroying Ukraine and moving towards global war. That’s one option,   
   which happens to be the one we’re following. There is another option.   
   Abandon the policies, our official policies, those I quoted. Move   
   towards accepting a status for Ukraine which is similar to Mexico,   
   Austria, Finland for decades, move towards establishing that, withdraw   
   the threats to Russia that are explicit in the policy statement I   
   mentioned. Move towards some kind of Minsk II style arrangement for a   
   high level of autonomy for the Eastern region, maybe within a federal   
   settlement. Recognize the reality that, like it or not, Crimea is off   
   the table, it’s not a negotiating option now.   
      
   That’s ugly, but the alternative is to continue our efforts to destroy   
   Ukraine and to move towards an international war. Those are the   
   choices. World is not a pretty place. You don’t have the choice of   
   electing Martin Luther King as the head of every government.   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: Dr. Noam Chomsky, thank you very, very much for   
   joining us. This has been delightful. Really appreciate you taking   
   this time.   
      
   Noam Chomsky: Sorry, got to move off the way -   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: Understand.   
      
   Noam Chomsky: …For the next one.   
      
   Bill Fletcher Jr.: Take care. Thank you very much.   
      
   And I want to thank all of you for joining us this evening. I hope you   
   enjoyed this as much as I did. And it’s one of those things where I   
   had at least another hour of questions and discussions and comments   
   that I wanted to offer, but this was a good taste. This was good. And   
   I’m hoping you enjoy it. I’m hoping that you will provide support to   
   The Real News Network, that you will provide support to Convergence   
   Magazine, get a subscription. That you will access different   
   organizations that have sponsored this program. That you’ll engage in   
   discussions and activism against the various imperialist powers out   
   there that bring us closer and closer to extinction. I want to thank   
   you very much again. My name is Bill Fletcher, and goodnight to you.   
      
   Source:   
   https://chomsky.info/20220408/   
      
   --- SoupGate-DOS v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)