5091b4ab   
   XPost: rec.arts.books.tolkien   
   From: david@trimboli.name   
      
   On 9/3/2011 12:55 PM, Christopher Kreuzer wrote:   
   > On Sep 3, 4:21 am, sean_q  wrote:   
   >> On 9/2/2011 4:38 PM, Christopher Kreuzer wrote:   
   >>   
   >>> Try writing in archaic style (like I did above). It is hard to do!   
   >>> Most people end up writing like Shakespeare, rather than Tolkien.   
   >>   
   >> To write like Tolkien; that would indeed be a great talent.   
   >   
   >    
   >   
   > But do you think it came naturally to him, or did he have to polish   
   > his prose? Some of his drafts he wrote and rewrote (and never   
   > published). Others were written almost or actually complete at the   
   > first attempt. So what I'm asking is whether the passages where he   
   > uses archaic style, did he have to slow down there or not? I guess we   
   > will never know, but there are less examples than you might think.   
   >   
   > On a brief look through, I only found a few:   
   >   
   > 1) The words Halbarad brings to Aragorn from Elrond and Arwen, both   
   > these messages use constructions such as thou, cometh, and thee.   
   >   
   > 2) The words of the Witch-King to Eowyn: thee, thy, thee, thy, thy   
   > [...] thou.   
   >   
   > 3) The words of the Mouth of Sauron: thee, thou, hast, shalt,   
   > shouldst. Interestingly, after his opening salvo, the Mouth of Sauron   
   > lapses back into normal speech. Is this intentional on his and   
   > Tolkien's part?   
      
   It is certainly intentional. I remember reading or hearing somewhere   
   (the Tolkien Professor?) that Tolkien wanted to portray a form of the   
   language that to hobbit ears was older and archaic. In modern English,   
   however, only the formal forms survived; it's the personal forms that   
   disappeared. To represent the archaic-sounding language, therefore,   
   Tolkien used the archaic personal forms, not intending that their   
   original personal meaning should come across to modern readers.   
      
   In other words, just as English is used in place of Westron, so archaic   
   English personal forms are used in place of archaic Westron (but not   
   archaic personal forms of Westron).   
      
   --   
   David Trimboli   
   http://www.trimboli.name/   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)