XPost: rec.arts.books.tolkien   
   From: mr@sandman.net   
      
   In article ,   
    Troels Forchhammer  wrote:   
      
   > >> I mean, cauliflower is _bloemkohl_ (IIRC) in Dutch and _blomkål_   
   > >> in Danish, and good day is _goddag_ in Danish -- just a couple of   
   > >> 'e's from the Dutch . . .   
   > >   
   > > Danish is a mess. I'm from Sweden and Swedish, Norwegian and   
   > > Danish is considered almost dialects to the rest of the world, but   
   > > while I can fully understand most Norwegians, Danish people speak   
   > > as if they're not only trying to pronounce "blomkål", they have   
   > > the mouth full if it as well!   
   > >   
   > > When in Denmark, I tell them to speak English :)   
   >   
   > Actually Swedish and Danish are, linguistically speaking, closer   
   > relatives than either is to Norwegian (which ought to look and sound   
   > more like Icelandic and Faroese) -- it is just that between us we   
   > have (through our thoroughly colonialist / imperialist approach to   
   > the Norwegians) managed to mess up Norwegian to the point that it   
   > normally sounds and looks like a mix of Danish and Swedish  :-)   
      
   Haha :)   
      
   Well, since both denmark and Norway *was* sweden back in the days, the   
   linguistic inheritance lines are muddy to say the least.   
      
   > Unfortunately the situation you describe is how many percieve it --   
   > and these days it is even true of many young people who live close by   
   > Sweden, but I think there is still hope.   
   >   
   > Most Danes born before ca. 1980 who have lived where they could   
   > receive Swedish television can normally understand written Swedish   
   > quite well, and will be able to understand spoken Swedish if they   
   > make just a small effort (and the Swede is willing to slow down a   
   > bit).   
      
   While this may be true - no Swedes, or at least most Swedes, do not   
   get exposed to Danish through the media in any way. I think if you   
   live in Malmö, you can get Danish TV3, but I have a hard time seeing   
   anyone watching it :)   
      
   > On the other hand, I have always found that if the people on both   
   > sides are willing to make an effort, understanding is much better   
   > when we speak Swedish and Danish than when we resort to try English   
   > (which most Danes and Swedes, while reasonably proficient for a non-   
   > native language, are no-where near as proficient at as we tend to   
   > believe).   
      
   Can't say about the danes, but having worked with lots of american   
   people, I get told a lot that Swedes are generally good at English   
      
   > So, to my eyes the problem, in Denmark, seems rather to be that   
   > people can't be bothered to actually make an effort (and have an   
   > overrated opinion of their own proficiency at English, which is seen   
   > as more prestigious).  I cannot say if the same is true in Sweden,   
   > but based on the encounters that I have had with Swedes, I'd say that   
   > there need not be a problem at all if we just make an effort.   
      
   Maybe it's just me that is reluctant to make an effort then :-D   
      
   > Oh -- and I'm sorry if I come across as preaching: my own kids are   
   > thoroughly fed up with hearing their father go on about how they can   
   > easily understand Swedish if they just make an effort, but it our   
   > common Scandinavian heritage is something that I do feel is important   
   > :-)   
      
   Well, I do too, actually :)   
      
      
      
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