XPost: rec.arts.books.tolkien   
   From: g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies   
      
   In message    
     Steve Hayes  wrote:   
   > On Thu, 5 Jun 2014 19:23:18 +0000 (UTC), Lewis   
   >  wrote:   
      
   >>In message <3pa0p9d93g04c324h90ehdujlg2ngb849m@4ax.com>   
   >>  Steve Hayes  wrote:   
   >>> On Thu, 5 Jun 2014 04:51:33 +0000 (UTC), Lewis   
   >>>  wrote:   
   >>   
   >>>>In message <91luo91pg8ecuhecms1ad2s45n386gchg2@4ax.com>   
   >>>>  Paul S  Person  wrote:   
   >>>>> On Tue, 03 Jun 2014 20:16:44 +0200, Taemon  wrote:   
   >>>>   
   >>>>>>On 1-6-2014 18:58, Paul S. Person wrote:   
   >>>>>>> On Sun, 01 Jun 2014 13:38:56 +0200, Taemon  wrote:   
   >>>>>>>> On 27-5-2014 18:57, Paul S. Person wrote:   
   >>>>>>>>> On Mon, 26 May 2014 23:08:40 +0200, Taemon  wrote:   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>>Hey,   
   >>>>>>   
   >>>>>>I'm really busy for a couple of days and won't have the headspace to   
   >>>>>>have this discussion properly. I'll be back later. Still enjoying it :-)   
   >>>>   
   >>>>> No problem, but you might want to have it with Lewis, who appears to   
   >>>>> believe that you can't possible adopt the position you have adopted   
   >>>>> because no one can be allowed to do so. That's right, I said   
   >>>>> "allowed", because that, I think, best summarizes his attitude.   
   >>>>   
   >>>>People are not allowed to state that their beliefs, fantasies, and   
   >>>>opinions are facts when they are not. that I would agree with.   
   >>   
   >>> Well you'd have to, wouldn't you, since you described your own belief that   
   God   
   >>> does not exist as a "fact". It is, too, if it is what you in fact believe.   
   >>   
   >>No, I never said I believe god does not exist. You are mangling words.   
   >>   
   >>There is no evidence of god (any god), therefore there is no god. That   
   >>is a statement of FACT, not belief, not opinion, not faith, not   
   >>delusion, not fantasy.   
      
   > I never said that you said that you believe that god does not exist. I said   
   > that you believe that god does not exist.   
      
   That is not true.   
      
   >>> I can say that it is a fact that the sun rose this morning, but someone   
   might   
   >>> argue that that is not a fact, since I saw it from the earth, and the   
   earth is   
   >>> rotating in such a way that the sun happened to become visible to me.   
   >>   
   >>The word 'rise' is relative, so the event described is relative. As a   
   >>*relative* description of an event, "The sun rose this morning" is a   
   >>fact.   
      
   > Hmm, a couple of paragraphs earlier you were saying that facts are absolute,   
      
   Facts are absolute. Relative *verbs* are not absolute.   
      
   > but now you're saying that they can be relative.   
      
   No, I never said that.   
      
   --   
   You too will get old. And when you do you'll fantasize that when you   
   were young prices where reasonable, politicians were noble, and children   
   respected their elders. Respect your elders.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)