XPost: rec.arts.books.tolkien   
   From: mr@sandman.net   
      
   In article , Stan Brown wrote:   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > "Nine he gave to Mortal Men, proud and great, and so ensnared   
   > > them"   
   >   
   > > They were "proud and great", "and so", i.e. "therefore" they were   
   > > ensnared.   
   >   
   > The "and so" refers to the giving of Rings, not to the pride and   
   > greatness of the Men. I'm not sure if you're saying that, or   
   > something different.   
      
   I'm saying it's both. The fact that men were "proud and great" is pertinent   
   information in how they could be ensared. The entire paragraph reads:   
      
   "The Three, fairest of all, the Elf-lords hid from him, and his hand never   
   touched them or sullied them. Seven the Dwarf-kings possessed, but three he   
   has recovered, and the others the dragons have consumed. Nine he gave to   
   Mortal Men, proud and great, and so ensnared them. Long ago they fell under   
   the dominion of the One, and they became Ringwraiths"   
      
   Men are the only race above that is given a personality description, and is   
   also the only one being ensnared. It is clear that the "proud and great" is   
   greatly connected to the reason why they were able to be ensnared, it's not   
   merely a offhand comment about men in general.   
      
   Compare with:   
      
   	I gave money for lunch to Peter who saved it, Michael who   
   	forgot it and Anna, a blonde, who ate the money.   
      
   It's pretty much the same relation. Anna being "blonde" is a stereotypical   
   description that carries a certain inherent interpretation of her   
   character, but doesn't in itself mean anything.   
      
   But in the above, Anna did something stupid, and the narrator certainly   
   added this stereotypical personality description to explain why, and since   
   the two others didn't do something stupid, their actions need no   
   justification.   
      
      
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