From: mr@sandman.net   
      
   In article <4f2h8a935f46jgg1vtjj2l62mcko2fkvsj@4ax.com>, Paul S. Person  wrote:   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > The movie starts with Smaug's assault on Laketown, this is a   
   > > rather underwhelming part, since in short he breathes some fire   
   > > and then is shot down by Bard. End of Smaug. It is clearly bad   
   > > pacing due to the fact that two movies became three movies. I feel   
   > > that Smaug deserved more screentime in the final movie, which   
   > > meant we should have seen less of him in the middle movie.   
   >   
   > I think they were too busy giving him a nice, warm, vermin-killing   
   > gold bath.   
      
   It's the other way around. When it was decided it would be three movies,   
   the entire chase sequence in Erebor was added as a result. With two movies,   
   the second movie would have started with them entering Erebor and   
   confronting Smaug, and there would have been no need for such a scene, the   
   desolation of Laketown would have sufficed.   
      
   > So, it /is/ Bard (imprisoned in the second film, IIRC) and not his   
   > son who gets Smaug?   
      
   Yup, his son helps though. :)   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > We then cut to Erebor where Thorin is busy being mad by "dragon   
   > > sickness", which is a bit forced from his battle sequence at the   
   > > end of the last movie. It's more or less in line with the book, so   
   > > I won't whine about it too much.   
   >   
   > Actually, from this point on, /all/ the Erebor stuff sounds pretty   
   > consistent with the book. Changed a bit, no doubt, to make it into a   
   > film, but that almost always happens.   
      
   Yes, this movie is by far the most book-true of all. Apart from the added   
   scenes in Dol Goldur and a sidestep to Gundabad, it's pretty much all   
   there, which is nice.   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > In Dol Goldur, Galadriel show up to rescue Gandalf, after which   
   > > the nine ringwraiths appear. And this is really poorly done. They   
   > > appear as translucent "ghosts" in mid-air and float about like no   
   > > one's business. But we already have a precedent how they are   
   > > supposed to look *if you can see them*. As we know, they are   
   > > invisible without their cloaks (which they're not wearing). And if   
   > > you want to argue that the members of the White Council should be   
   > > able to see them, then at least they should look like how Frodo   
   > > sees them on Weathertop.   
   >   
   > These are the wringwraiths before the Force was used to age them ...   
   > oh, sorry, that was the Emperor in another movie.   
      
   :)   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > Elrond and Saruman also appear and a fight squence ensues where   
   > > Elrond fights them with a sword and Saruman with his staff. When   
   > > defeated (whatever that means) Sauron appears and "resurrects"   
   > > them (whatever that means) and says that darkness is coming.   
   > > Galadriel then switch to her "dark queen" mode and use what   
   > > appears to be the Light of Earendil to banish Sauron from Dol   
   > > Goldur. The entire sequence is rather quick and a bit   
   > > unsatisfactory. I had hoped for this to be more of an event where   
   > > the white council drives Sauron from Dol Goldur.   
   >   
   > Well, it certainly /should/ have been. It almost sounds as if they   
   > found they had gone done a wrong path and were trying to get out of   
   > it as quickly as possible. Then again, my immediate reaction to   
   > reading about it is "the shorter the better". What I will think when   
   > I see it remains to be seen; it may well seem rushed to me as well.   
      
   Probably. It's a bit like rescue gandlaf! Fight ringwraiths1 banish Sauron!   
   Oh, time over for supper!   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > Thorin at this time sulks inside his mountain, but he (literally)   
   > > shakes off his sickness and even though they had armed up for war   
   > > before, they now join the charge when all seems lost, but not   
   > > wearing the battle armor they earlier put on. Weird.   
   >   
   > Film companies employ people (called "continuity" in the credits)   
   > /precisely/ in order to avoid these glitches.   
      
   No, this isn't a continuity error. They garb up when the elfs and men mass   
   around Erebor, and confront them in full golden armor, looks awesome. Then   
   the Ironihill dwarves arrive and THorin just retreats back into the   
   mountain. Apparently all dwarves removes their armour, frustrated that they   
   can't join the battle, so when THorin comes around, they have their normal   
   garb.   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > The events that follows aren't too far from the book. We have the   
   > > obligatory stand-off between Thorin and Azog, the demise of Fili   
   > > and Kili and Legolas fights Bolg. This all happens on top of a   
   > > mountainside/tower instead of in the battlefield but that was   
   > > allright by me.   
   >   
   > > All in all, this may have been the movie adaptation of Tolkien's   
   > > work that stayed the most true to its source material. That said,   
   > > there are some things that stand out, here's a few:   
   >   
   > Arguably so, from what you are saying. I look forward to it eagerly.   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > Tauriel and Kili While a love affair between an elf and a dwarve   
   > > is pretty outlandish to begin with, even if the dwarf is as   
   > > handsome as Kili, it is taken to unreasonable heights in this   
   > > movie. It was merely hinted at in the last movie, which was, well   
   > > "ok". Here it is outright "true love" and when Kili is killed,   
   > > Tauriel weeps. It's out of place and they've met, what, three   
   > > times? Please.   
   >   
   > Actually, instant true love isn't that uncommon in films. Or books,   
   > for that matter. It may or may not be in real life, but a film with   
   > Elves, Dwarves, Dragons, Orcs and other oddities isn't exactly "real   
   > life", now is it?   
      
   That's Disney movies, not actual movies, unless they're pretty old. Movies   
   with "instant true love" still have scenes that establish the love to be   
   true, which Kili+Tauriel severly lacks. We'll see what the Extended Edition   
   brings to the table.   
      
   > And not just chick flicks/rom-coms; consider /The Fisher King/.   
   > "It's like they were made for each other." Or even /The King and I/:   
   > the song "Some enchanted evening".   
      
   Been a while since I saw either, so can't comment.   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > Alfrid The comic relief sidekick of the master of lake town, he's   
   > > way over the top and every scene with him is pure agony.   
   >   
   > Perhaps he took lessons from Radagast (in the first film).   
      
   He's way worse.   
      
   > > Sandman:   
   > > Huge "trolls" When the second wave of orc's arrive, they bring   
   > > with them enormous trolls with large catapults on their backs.   
   > > This feels like just an obvious throwback to the Mumakil of LotR,   
   > > but luckily we don't have Legolas killing one without breaking a   
   > > sweat. :)   
   >   
   > In the trailer, they looked like the ones operating the Black Gate.   
      
   No, they are way larger. The one's operating the black gate is the same   
   size as the cave troll in Moria.   
      
   > Also, in the trailer, they appeared to be immune to sunlight.   
      
   Yeah, sunlight has no effect on either trolls or orc's in this movie, and   
   Gandlaf even comment on a lot of the orcs being orcs of Mordor, however   
   that is even possible.   
      
   > Perhaps the theory is that, since the Uruk-hai can resist the sun,   
   > so can the Oleg-hai.   
      
      
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