XPost: rec.arts.drwho, alt.fan.douglas-adams   
   From: solar.penguin@gmail.com   
      
   On Sun, 13 Aug 2017 12:52:07 +0100, Angrymadman wrote...   
      
   > On 13/08/2017 11:42, solar penguin wrote:   
   >>   
   >> I mentioned The Silmarillion and Hitchhikers above, so let's take that   
   >> as an example...   
   >>   
   >> Eru Ilúvatar told the Ainur to create the Earth. / Deep Thought told   
   >> the Magratheans to create the Earth.   
   >>   
   >> While they created it, the sky was in total darkness, not even any   
   >> stars.  /  While they created it, the planet was in the darkness of a   
   >> hyperspace chamber inside Magrathea.   
   >>   
   >> Later the Earth was just lit by stars before the sun or moon finally   
   >> arrived.  /  Later the Earth was just lit by stars as it was towed   
   >> through the galaxy to its position in our solar system.   
   >>   
   >> The first human-like people on the Earth were Elves, with the real   
   >> humans created separately later.  /  The first human-like people on the   
   >> Earth were Neanderthals, with the real humans arriving later in their   
   >> B-Ark.   
   >>   
   >> See?  These are clearly the same events being told from two different   
   >> perspectives.   
   >   
   > No they are not. Who created Ilúvatar and for what purpose? We know   
   > who/what Deep Thought was created by and why.   
   >   
      
   Of course the in-universe chroniclers thought that Ilúvatar had no   
   creator.  That doesn't necessarily mean they were right.  The whole point   
   of playing at merging universes is to learn new things that you could   
   never learn just from studying one set of stories alone.   
      
   >   
   >> But... Eru knew the humans would appear.  That was all part of His   
   >> plan. Had Deep Thought planned for the arrival of the arrival of the   
   >> B-Ark?  If so, Ford and Arthur must've been just plain wrong when they   
   >> speculated that the human's arrival had damaged the program to find the   
   >> Ultimate Question.   
   >>   
   >> How can that be?  Perhaps the Question wasn't supposed to be found by   
   >> Humans and/or Elves in the first place, but by something else, such as   
   >> the dolphins.  (Remember that if someone knows the Question and Answer,   
   >> the universe will end and be replaced by a different, weirder one.  And   
   >> in So Long And Thanks For All The Fish, the dolphins were responsible   
   >> for replacing the universe with a different one in which the Earth   
   >> wasn't destroyed.  Now we know how they did it!)   
   >   
   > How do Melkor and Sauron come into this?   
   >   
      
   There have been many attempts to disrupt the Ultimate Question and Answer   
   project, from Vroomfondel and Majikthise to Gag Halfrunt and the Vogons.   
   Melkor and Sauron clearly fit into that pattern.   
      
   >   
   >> Meanwhile, this helps fix one of the biggest problems with The   
   >> Silmarillion: it's propaganda.  The characters are all supposed to be   
   >> the greatest, wisest, noblest, most intelligent, most honorable, most   
   >> noble, best looking, best warriors, best rulers, etc. even when their   
   >> actions say otherwise.  There are no ordinary, average people for us to   
   >> relate to.   
   >>   
   >>   
   > The Silmarillion is a deliberate allegory to Genesis and Revelation in   
   > the bible. It's blatantly obvious from the first few pages. It's about   
   > man's fall from grace from heaven, Satan (Melkor) and coming of the   
   > beast (Sauron). The entire thing is Christian metaphor just like the   
   > Chronicles of Narnia.   
      
   "I cordially dislike allegory in all its manifestations, and always have   
   done so since I grew old and wary enough to detect its presence ... I   
   think that many confuse 'applicability' with 'allegory'; but the one   
   resides in the freedom of the reader, and the other in the purposed   
   domination of the author." -- J.R.R. Tolkien   
      
   > No. You've not merged either universe. Where is your story cross linking   
   > them which is common to both? I took the story arc which set up the   
   > Lensman universe and its history from the retconed version of   
   > Triplanetary--which E. E. Smith used to make it part of the Lensman   
   > universe when it was originally an unconnected story--and added the   
   > Doctor to it, in a new story which too place in that arc. E. E. Smith   
   > also wrote First Lensman as a bridging story to fill the gap between   
   > Triplanetary and Galactic Patrol.   
   >   
   > What have you done in that respect? Does Arthur Dent join Bilbo and   
   > Frodo Baggins fighting Orcs? Does Gandalf create Slartybartfast as an   
   > avatar from himself to use to build Earth in the same way Mentor creates   
   > Bergenholm to perfect the inertia free drive?   
      
   What I'm doing here is a form of "Wold Newtonry", writing essays on how   
   stories can share a universe.  I leave writing actual stories to those   
   who actually enjoy writing stories.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)