XPost: alt.agnosticism, alt.athiesm, alt.atheism   
   From: nobody@nowhere.com   
      
   On Thu, 09 Jun 2011 06:21:44 -0400, old man joe wrote:   
      
   >   
   > if it were commanded by God to prove to another person there is the Living   
   > God then that's the same as saying the unbeliever is not responcible to   
   > God since the unbeliever must be convinced in his own mind of the reality   
   > of God...  if he can not be convinced then he thinks himself not   
   > responcible to God.   
   >   
   > this is a pretty neat cop-out on the part of the unbeliever.   
   >   
   > the facts are simple and direct however with God's own words... the   
   > unbeliever knows full well there is the Living God he is required to obey   
   > and he is " without excuse. "  that's what the unbeliever is trying so   
   > desperately to do... excuse himself from responsibility toward God...   
   >   
   > " For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and   
   > unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;  Because   
   > that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it   
   > unto them. {in them: or, to them}   
   >   
   >  For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are   
   >  clearly seen, being understood   
   > by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that   
   > they are without excuse: Because that, when they knew God, they glorified   
   > him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their   
   > imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened."  Ro.1:18-21 and   
   > following.   
   >   
   > so then, since the Almighty makes Himself known to the unbeliever in God's   
   > own way, no person is charged with trying to convince another person of   
   > the reality that God exists.  it's as simple as that.   
      
   It's not simple at all, as you have glossed over the all-important   
   question, "What is the Living God"?  It is pretty clear that we are all   
   genetically programmed, by evolution, to behave in social groups.  That   
   requires us to sacrifice personal ambitions for the good of the group.   
   Before we understood evolution, it was hard to explain such programming,   
   so people invented a god as a way to explain an important mystery.  Once   
   you have a god, people spend lifetimes trying to make their god into their   
   own image.  Thus we have a god who is variously described as vengeful,   
   jealous, genocidal, kind, merciful, forgiving, indifferent, and even   
   non-existent.   
      
   If you expect people to believe in YOUR god, it is necessary for you to   
   prove that your god is something more than a projection of your own   
   insecurities.   
      
   --   
   MarkA   
   Keeper of Things Put There Only Just The Night Before   
   About eight o'clock   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)