XPost: alt.animals.ethics.vegetarian, talk.politics.animals, misc.rural   
      
   "The opportunity for potential livestock to "get to   
   experience life" deserves *NO* moral consideration   
   whatever" - Goo   
      
   "I give the lives of animals that exist *LOTS*   
   of consideration." - Goo   
      
   "the "getting to experience life" deserves NO   
   moral consideration, and is given none" - Goo   
      
   "I also give the not-yet-begun lives of animals   
   that are "in the pipeline", so to speak, a lot of   
   consideration" - Goo   
      
   "There is no "consideration" to be given." - Goo   
      
      
      
   "Life is not a benefit for farm animals." - Goo   
      
   "Their lives may be pleasant for them." - Goo   
      
   ""Life", by which you mean coming into existence, is not   
   a benefit at all" - Goo   
      
   "We ARE NOT, and NEVER WERE, talking about whether   
   existing animals "benefit" from living." - Goo   
      
   "Those "lives of positive value" are only meaningful   
   *IF* the livestock exist. " - Goo   
      
   "The topic is not and never has been whether or not   
   existing animals enjoy living." - Goo   
      
   "IF they exist, then they can benefit (or not) from the   
   aspects of their lives." - Goo   
      
   "No farm animals benefit from farming." - Goo   
      
   "We are not and never were talking about benefits for   
   existing entities" - Goo   
      
   "Coming into existence is not a benefit to them" - Goo   
      
      
      
   "Set your clock back by an hour" - Goo   
      
   "I didn't say to set your clock back an hour" - Goo   
      
   "When the entity moves from "pre-existence" into the   
   existence we know" - Goo   
      
   "I never said they "move from 'pre-existence'"" - Goo   
      
   "we don't know if that move improves its welfare" - Goo   
      
   "the deliberate killing of animals for use by humans DOES   
   deserve moral consideration, and gets it." - Goo   
      
   "Intent doesn't matter" - Goo   
      
   "ONLY deliberate human killing deserves any moral   
   consideration." - Goo   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)