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|    Message 90,139 of 90,437    |
|    anthk to Street    |
|    Re: Consciousness (4/5)    |
|    19 Apr 25 07:34:10    |
      [continued from previous message]              > intentionality or freedom being able to choose your own path, as opposed       > to proceeding down a preprogrammed path. Well, physics tells us that       > even elementary particles have that, in the simplest possible form:       > quantum indeterminacy (the idea that the physical facts of the universe       > seem to be indeterminate on the subatomic level).       >       > In fact, if you ask Levin the classic question How low can you go? Is       > there anything in the world thats not somewhere on the spectrum of       > cognition? hell tell you: "I dont believe there is a zero in our       > world."       >       > Hes happy to acknowledge that the level of indeterminacy in an       > elementary particle is a "very stupid-low level of freedom," but its       > not nothing. And thats all the panpsychist needs in order to explain       > consciousness as a simple story of scaling. Once upon a time, there was       > a little particle that was a little bit conscious. It got together with       > more particles, and they formed a cell that was a little bit more       > conscious. It got together with more cells, and they formed an animal       > that was even more conscious        >       > The biggest challenge to panpsychism: the combination problem       > But wait a second. Theres a problem for the panpsychist here. If the       > tiniest particles have conscious experiences, how exactly do they       > combine to produce a more complex thing with its own conscious       > experience? Whats more, how do we explain things like tables or chairs?       > Panpsychists generally do not argue that those things are conscious       > subjects but how do we explain why they arent, while the collection of       > atoms known as a human is?       >       > This is known as the "combination problem," and its typically seen as       > the biggest challenge to panpsychism. Any panpsychist owes you an       > explanation of why they think the littlest bits are conscious, and       > humans are conscious, but the table is not.       >       > Our old friend Giordano Bruno anticipated this way back in the 16th       > century. He argued that even though the tiniest "corpuscles" inside a       > table are conscious, they do not produce a unified conscious subject       > when they come together in the form of an inorganic object. "I say,       > then, that the table is not animated as a table, nor are the clothes as       > clothes," he wrote, but "in all things there is spirit, and there is not       > the least corpuscle that does not contain within itself some portion       > that may animate it."       >       > Panpsychists like Leidenhag make the same move today. "I think it       > follows our intuitions to say that a table isnt conscious because the       > parts are not interacting together theres no real unity going on with a       > table," she told me. "Whereas with a plant, there really is clear       > unity."       >       > In other words, a plant is a goal-directed system with unity of purpose.       > Its parts are all working together as a team to perform the essential       > processes that keep the system running. Thats very different from a       > table, where particles are squished together but are not collaborating.       >       > A small budding flower on a fuzzy stem, outlined by golden sunlight.       > A small budding flower on a fuzzy stem, outlined by golden sunlight.       > That sounded to me like Leidenhag was saying that the table is not       > conscious because its not alive. So I asked her if she thinks that       > aliveness and consciousness are one and the same.       >       > "What I would say is aliveness is one name for the process by which       > conscious parts unify to form new conscious wholes," she replied. "So I       > could say that a single electron is not alive, but it is conscious. And       > when it is part of a living system, it creates a bigger consciousness."       >       > Leidenhag acknowledges that she cant prove an electron is conscious or       > that panpsychism is right about consciousness. But, she told me, "I       > think its the most plausible of a bunch of implausible views about       > consciousness."       >       > Strawson said the same thing. "Its the least worst view," he laughed.       >       > Heres the really funny thing: Panpsychists and materialists will both       > concede that they cant disprove the other camps view, because we dont       > have definitive evidence either way. Yet both believe their own view is       > the simplest and likeliest explanation the most "parsimonious," as       > Strawson and Seth each told me.       >       > Panpsychism has the advantage of letting us sidestep the hard problem.       > But materialism has an advantage, too: no combination problem. So, does       > one come out ahead?       >       > The difference between them may be more methodological than anything       > else. Materialism restricts itself to what it can establish empirically,       > testable detail by testable detail, with the hope of groping its way       > toward a broad theoretical framework. Panpsychism has historically let       > itself dream big, starting out with the broad theory and hoping to fill       > in the details later. Whats exciting is that scientists like Levin are       > now combining the methodology of materialism with the theory of       > panpsychism, seeing how they might fit together. These scientists are       > digging right underneath the wall that was erected in the 17th century       > the one that split matter from mind. Where that will lead is anyones       > guess.       >       > What are the ethical implications? Does panpsychism mean I cant eat       > anything?       >       > A few years ago, I was chatting about panpsychism with a friend. I       > mentioned that I dont know if the theory is true, but I hope it is.       > When my friend asked why, I said simply, "So many little buddies       > everywhere!"       >       > To me, panpsychism offered an enchanted view of the world. I suspected       > that if it were the prevailing view, people might be less likely to feel       > lonely or to destroy nature, because theyd see kin everywhere.       >       > But my friend had a totally different reaction. He was horrified by the       > idea of panpsychism. "Think of how much suffering there could be in the       > world!" he said.       >       > His reaction points to the big ethical question looming over       > panpsychism: If its right, then how the hell are we supposed to live?       > If everything is conscious, then can we not eat anything?       >       > For one thing, panpsychism doesnt argue that everything is equally       > conscious. Different things are conscious to different degrees, so we       > might feel different levels of moral obligation to them.       >       > "It has made me a more committed vegetarian because its just made me       > more sensitive to the consciousness of other creatures. It forces you to       > think about your moral reasoning," Leidenhag told me. But, she added, "I       > dont think that it makes it impossible for you to go about your life       > consuming things."       >       > While the consciousness of a given creature may matter a lot, morally       > speaking, lots of other things matter, too. Consider our relationship to       > the creature: Have we made it dependent on us by domesticating it, or       > does it live in the wild? Has it had the chance to live a full life? Is       > it fundamentally hostile to us? Bedbugs may have some degree of       > consciousness, but that doesnt mean youre a moral monster if you call       > an exterminator. Your own ability to survive and thrive is also part of       > the moral calculus. Its probably inevitable that sometimes the       > interests of different conscious beings are going to be in tension with       > each other, or flat-out incompatible; when that happens, we have to make       > choices as best we can.       >              [continued in next message]              --- SoupGate-DOS v1.05        * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)    |
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