XPost: rec.music.bluenote, rec.music.makers.trumpet, alt.fan.sting   
   From: slik9@cox.net   
      
   Form that's what! You can make  bread dough, flatten & stretch it, put some   
   olive oil on it maybe some onions & some will think it;s onion flatbread but   
   I swear it's white pizza especiallywith the simple addition of grating   
   cheese. If there's too much pop in the music form, then it's pop or rock or   
   whatever. Jazz presupposes pedigree or at least a high degree of it. It   
   ain;t like getting admitted to a native american tribe like the pequots in   
   the early days of gambling casino success, like you needed proof of 1/16   
   portion of you lineage  being pequot.  There has to be some sense of purity   
   as well as loyalty to the form.   
   I love Sting's work and doubtlessly some of it will be covered by what may   
   be considered light Jazz Artists or maybe even real ones. Certainly Steely   
   Dan, who I also  have high regard for has been covered by such artists and   
   pretty well too. I know of no other Pop/Jazz artists who know chord   
   structures and changes that bear profound resemblance to Jazz . Sting   
   actually writes a bit less frequently in that jazz structure (chord   
   changes/progressions) idom. It does seem that artists who first make their   
   bones in Jazz then crossover   
   maintain more credibility. I'm not so sure that is fair. Noones going to   
   question Miles on Bitches Brew. It's like Micheal Jordan just didn't get   
   scrutinized by the officials.  I wonder about the Mahavisnu Orchestra &   
   others in the 80's fusion trend. Carlos Santana crossed over to Jazz from   
   the rock/pop side and achieved some acceptance. Then there is a history of   
   Latin flavored music being accepted & informing Jazz Artists. Perhaps for   
   the same reason Mahavisnu was considered Jazz, because of his bitchin   
   playin.  The character or form of John McClaughlin's music, at least for me,   
   now seems too agro, with a bit too much emphasis on speed and power to be   
   Jazz. Jazz allows for subtlety & you can find more of that in Sting & Steely   
   Dan. Always there seems to be a strong emphasis on the technical mastery of   
   the instrument. The renowned in Jazz usually play there respective axes   
   better or at least in the challenging & more purely Jazz style than the   
   artists from the popular side. Albeit Jazz artists like Branford Marsalis   
   can make Sting sound all the better, thanks in part to Sting's good taste.   
   Of course then there is the writing itself & here I suspect Sting and S.D.   
   ie. Fagen & Becker may be capable of beating some of the competition if they   
   chose to write in a more pure Jazz idiom. Fagen has maybe hit the mark in   
   some cases on Aja. The pocketbook would suffer if they truly, consistently   
   wrote with the focus on the instrumentation.  In the Jazz age you could   
   write pretty music with interesting changes and some capable crooner could   
   score a hit record with it. Now maybe Diana Krall, now Elvis Costellos   
   spouse ( maybe she'll lend a bit of credibility to him, it's like Arny   
   marrying a Kennedy ain't it )is the closet to that. Sting is one hell one a   
   good vocalist and his covers of traditional Jazz hits from soundtracks are   
   great like My One And Only Love. All I can sayis thank the lord there's only   
   one Kenny G., with all of the chops and precious little of the taste or soul   
   of real Jazz players or Micheal Bolton, every afficionados whipping boy.   
   Well keep wearing your hair long & your pants tight around the crotch dude &   
   doubltlessly the ladys will keep  tossing their  little Victorias Secret up   
   on stage. Well as someone said about religion or art, how would something so   
   sublime ever be agreed upon. To end like the previous soundbite oriented   
   posters - listen to Coltrane & you'll know the difference. It's there for   
   your ears, your mind & most of all your spirit. Comments other than get a   
   life, job, etc. welome.   
   KC   
      
      
      
      
   manitou wrote in message ...   
   >The Enunciator wrote:   
   >   
   >> I don't have a definition of jazz...You're just supposed to know it   
   >> when you hear it.   
   >> - Thelonious Monk   
   >>   
   >> Man, if you gotta ask, you'll never know.   
   >> - Louis Armstrong   
   >   
   >"People think it's a math test"   
   >   
   >- Chris Botti (recent TV appearance)   
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   >C.   
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   >   
   >> Keith Freeman wrote:   
   >>   
   >>>>I don't.   
   >>>   
   >>>So what does make jazz jazz in your opinion? You've been sidestepping   
   >>>this issue throughout the thread.   
   >   
      
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