eb547584   
   XPost: rec.arts.poems, alt.arts.poetry.comments   
   From: will.dockery@gmail.com   
      
   On Sunday, September 17, 2023 at 5:59:54 PM UTC-4, David Dalton wrote:   
   > On Sep 17, 2023, Michael Pendragon wrote   
   > (in article<0bf762c1-79a0-4934...@googlegroups.com>):   
   > > On Sunday, September 17, 2023 at 12:38:09 AM UTC-4, David Dalton wrote:   
   > > > On Sep 17, 2023, Michael Pendragon wrote   
   > > > (in article<59226ee5-891a-4553...@googlegroups.com>):   
   > > > > On Saturday, September 16, 2023 at 10:23:50 PM UTC-4, David Dalton   
   wrote:   
   > > > > > On Sep 16, 2023, Michael Pendragon wrote   
   > > > > > (in article<4eb745ae-5eef-4d4b...@googlegroups.com>):   
   > > > > > > On Saturday, September 16, 2023 at 12:30:12 AM UTC-4, David   
   Dalton   
   > > > > > > wrote:   
   > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > Then is early spring 1995 Ariane put me on the guest list   
   > > > > > > > for Shane MacGowan and The Popes with The Paperboys   
   > > > > > > > opening, at The Commodore Ballroom, and that is   
   > > > > > > > where the elbow pulling incident occurred. And it   
   > > > > > > > was no ordinary touch, but similar to that described in   
   > > > > > > > these lyrics by The Weather Station:   
   > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > "There was a time you put your hand on the small of my back I was   
   > > > > > > > surprised   
   > > > > > > > that you touched me like that   
   > > > > > > > But there in your hand was a current of life   
   > > > > > > > I could hardly stand.”   
   > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > It was an electric, warming, compatible touch, but I didn’t   
   > > > > > > > realize it was her until after the later stare incident occurred,   
   > > > > > > > since she ran off so fast.   
   > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > Wait a second...   
   > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > She allegedly pulled your elbow.   
   > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > She then wrote a song about someone (unidentified in the lyric)   
   putting   
   > > > > > > his   
   > > > > > > hand on the small of her back.   
   > > >   
   > > > > > Huh, I said that the lyrics about the small of the back were by   
   > > > > > The Weather Station, not by Sarah, but that it was a similar   
   > > > > > electric, warming, compatible touch. You are not a very   
   > > > > > good reader, and seem to be a contrarian.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > I'm a very good reader, David. I just don't have any knowledge of pop   
   music   
   > > > > (post 1964). I don't know a thing about Sarah McLachlan. I googled her   
   to   
   > > > > see   
   > > > > who you were talking about, and found the information about her   
   stalker on   
   > > > > Wikipedia. I assumed that the "Weather Station" was either Sarah's   
   album or   
   > > > > band.   
   > > > >   
   > > > > Now you're saying that some band that wasn't connected with Sarah   
   wrote a   
   > > > > lyric about a man placing his hand on the small of a woman's back, and   
   that   
   > > > > this is a secret reference to Sarah's having pulled your elbow?   
   > > > I didn’t say it was a reference to the elbow touch. I said it   
   > > > was a similar touch, this time between a bim and a   
   > > > straight-type-2-F, whereas Sarah and I are a bif and   
   > > > a straight-type-2-M.   
   > >   
   > > Apart from being a touch (and touches are very common occurrences), why   
   > > should Weather Station's lyric be about Sarah touching you?   
   > They aren’t, they are about a similar Touch.   
   > > > > 1) You wrote about Sarah in a fan group.   
   > > > > 2) A friend of hers *may* have brought some of your posts to her   
   attention.   
   > > > Obviously she did, based on Sarah’s behaviour towards me   
   > > > in the spring of 1995.   
   > >   
   > > 1) It isn't obvious to me.   
   > > 2) AFAICS Sarah's only "behavior" was to stare back (if she even was   
   staring)   
   > > at someone who was staring at her.   
   > No, I did not initiate the stare. I was coming back from the   
   > washroom and she was standing near the bar and directly   
   > faced me and stared at me as if I was her long lost lover.   
   > > > > 3) One night at a bar someone pulled your elbow, but you didn't see   
   who it   
   > > > > was.   
   > > > I saw her from behind, and my memory of the incident later   
   > > > was consistent with it being her.   
   > >   
   > > If you only saw her from behind, she might not have even been in the bar.   
   And   
   > > your memory of being pulled would be just as consistent if applied to   
   anyone   
   > > else who was in the bar.   
   > >   
   > > IMHO, people don't pull on the elbows of strangers (or even of friends). I   
   > > suspect that someone caught their jacket or purse on you as they passed. In   
   > > any case, the "pulling" would have been accidental.   
   > No, I was on some steps off to the side in a rapidly emptying   
   > bar, and she came up behind me and palmed my right   
   > elbow from behind and pulled it to the left, causing me   
   > to look to the left, and she ran off to the right. Again it   
   > was a warming, electric, compatible Touch, and was   
   > most definitely not accidental.   
   > > How can you be sure that Sarah simply wasn't lost in thought and completely   
   > > unaware of what her eyes appeared to be "staring" at?   
   > She wasn’t sitting down, she was planted standing about a metre   
   > away from me near the bar, full frontal, no doubt.   
   >   
   > I mentioned the songs Sweet Surrender and I Love You.   
   >   
   > Other references that may have been to me in her lyrics   
   > are:   
   >   
   > 1. I Will Remember You (IWRY)   
   >   
   > "But once there was a darkness, deep and endless night   
   > You gave me everything you had, oh you gave me light”   
   >   
   > which indicated that my playful writing brought her out   
   > of depression, like Jesus casting demons out of   
   > Mary Magdalene.   
   >   
   > 2. Do What You Have To Do   
   >   
   > "And I have the sense to recognize   
   > That I don’t know how to let you go   
   > Every moment marked with apparitions of your soul   
   > I’m ever swiftly moving, trying to escape this desire   
   >   
   >    
   >   
   > A glowing ember   
   > Burning hot and burning slow   
   > Deep within, I’m shaken by the violence   
   > Of existing for only you”   
   >   
   > 3. Adia   
   >   
   > "Adia I’m empty since you left me trying to find a way to carry on   
   > I search myself and everyone   
   > to see where we went wrong”   
   >   
   > (written after I left Vancouver at the end of 1995,   
   > and note that on the FTE list I referred to her as   
   > S quite often and myself as D at times, and in   
   > the song at times she says “A D” for Adia).   
   >   
   > 4. Building a Mystery   
   >   
   > (written after I wrote her a long letter that later served as   
   > a first draft for my Salmon on the Thorns web page)   
   >   
   > "Oh you’re so beautiful   
   > A beautiful fucked up man   
   > You’re setting up your   
   > Razor wire shrine   
   >   
   > ‘Cause you’re working   
   > Building a mystery   
   > Holding on, holding it in   
   > Oh yeah you’re working   
   > Building a mystery   
   > And choosing so carefully”   
   >   
   > (so that one was less complimentary. And when she   
   > did the song at a September 10, 2004 concert in   
   > Vancouver that I attended, when she said   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)