From: someone@anywheret.net   
      
   "JimD"  wrote in message news:201809140101571804-email@nowherecom...   
      
   > Beats me.  She makes no sense.  If I crank the system at rehearsal, she   
   > gets all upset. So it's not really a " volume " thing. I really,   
   > seriously, can't figure out what she wants. If I could, I would have   
   > solved this long ago.   
      
   It seems that she doesn't know either, and that this problem is a relatively   
   recent one.   
      
   > Today, we had a rehearsal, just her and I, and to demonstrate how loud we   
   > have been playing onstage, I brough the system up to our stage levels.   
   > It's digital, I can look at the meters and do that.   110 db peak, average   
   > in the high 90's to low 100 range.   Yep, that's just exactly where I   
   > thought we were.  And it took me about half an hour to get my hearing back   
   > to usable so we would work on new tunes. Yet we play entire gigs at that   
   > level .....   
      
   Further damage to hearing.   
      
   > Actually, we had a productive day.  Together we looked at a few videos on   
   > mixing and levels.  The preferred level in a pro studio is such that you   
   > can TALK over the music, at conversational levels.   If that's the case,   
   > and it is, then why are we rehearsing in the 90db range and playing out at   
   > 110db on the stage ?   Because SOMEONE in the band is an idiot. Maybe more   
   > than one someone.   
      
   It's not worth going deaf over!   
      
   > We both agree that getting our loud drummer to back off the volume is   
   > hopeless.   
      
   You could always put him in a cage ;)   
      
   > She says her hearing is fine, and that she's had it checked in the last   
   > few years.  Clearly, it isn't.   
      
   Not much of surprise there.   
      
   > Or, she's just very use to having the onstage level blaring, and she can't   
   > adjust to that not being there.   
      
   But that results in being used to not hearing very well as a result of   
   hearing loss.   
      
   > We did talk about the in ears some.  She didn't bring her's today, so no   
   > trying them.  What she is afraid of there is that, since we can't get the   
   > drummer to let up, she'll turn the in ears up and damage her hearing.   
   > That makes no sense to me. I won't turn mine up in any case, certainly not   
   > to mask drums.   
      
   A plexiglas cage would help.   
      
   > The SHURE 215's only block 25 or so db of outside sound. So, drummer   
   > hovering at 110,120 .... put the in ears in ... you get 85 to 90 db of   
   > acoustic bleed thru. To hear over that, she'll be running the signal in   
   > the 215's at 100 or more db.  That scares her.   
      
   I wasn't aware IEMs could be cranked to hearing damaging levels.   
      
   > And those numbers are about right.  I've tried using them early on with   
   > this crew, about 2 years back, and guess what ?    The in ears won't go   
   > loud enough to hear.   
      
   Probably some lawyer circuit to limit hearing damaging levels.   
      
   > Yep, in my ear, maxed out, I can't hear the signal over the stage level.   
   > Because the Shure 215's only go to 107db, according to how I read the spec   
   > sheet.   
      
   That should be more than Plenty  loud!   
      
   > So how do I expect them to work ?  Why do I want her to try them ?   
   > Maybe just to prove that they wont, and just how loud our stage level is.   
   > Only then, do I hope she'll go along with doing whatever it takes to drop   
   > the levels.  And that means get the drummer to let up, or else   
   .........   
      
   It's a simple engineering situation, and solution, and life is too short to   
   deal with those who want to make it any more than that...it only wastes   
   precious time, and Hearing!   
      
   > I thought about that.  Talked to her this week.  I've tried that before,   
   > for myself, in other bands.  It would work if you had a big enough   
   > monitor.   
      
   I don't care to have to stick things in my ears, or do anything else because   
   of IDIOTS!!!   
   IDIOTS are Unnecessary, and They should be the ones to go!!!   
      
   > Turns out we do. She has a nice Yamaha floor wedge.  We may use that this   
   > weekend.  Problem is, this goes back to the same problem. Put a monitor   
   > there, turn it up loud enough to be clearly heard, and guess what ?  The   
   > drummer will just play louder yet.  How do I know this ?  We've already   
   > tried it.   
      
   Those floor wedges can be pretty powerful - better to turn down instead!   
      
   > What did work once was we use the in ears, and get the drums far enough   
   > away that  the in ears will work.  Did that one time. Don't recall   
   > exactly, but I seem to remember wife was playing that gig, on her   
   > electronic drums ... so no stage level issues at all.   
      
   That's it, electronic drums - unless those are cranked up too.   
      
   > We're gonna try them this week at an outdoor concert we're playing.   
   > Maybe.  Maybe in the end we'll just use some wedges.  I dunno. This is   
   > wearing me out.   
      
   I'm sure of that, over and over and over ad infinitum ad nauseam.   
      
   > On another, more interesting point. A lady at our duo yesterday ask band   
   > girl after the show if she was really singing ?   Lady said we sounded so   
   > good, she suspected that we weren't actually singing ( or playing ) but   
   > rather that we were just miming to the records.   
      
   That's disgusting! I'd be offended!   
      
   > Get that ?   We sound so good, so much better than they expect live music   
   > to be, that some people don't believe we're actually playing and singing ?   
      
   You think that's something, wait until you get into Originals - they won't   
   believe what they're hearing, because it's probably been literally Decades   
   since they've heard FRESH MUSIC!!!   
      
   > And yet, on top of that, band girls ex musician buddies are beating her   
   > down telling her how bad our out front mix is.   
      
   Psychological Warfare is effective Only if the intended Victims/Targets GO   
   ALONG WITH IT!!!   
      
   > It's a crazy world. I have some good thoughts on this, but it's late. More   
   > tomorrow.   
      
      
   JimD   
      
   It's the endless rehashing that makes it really Crazy!   
      
   Ouisie   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)