From: someone@anywheret.net   
      
   "JimD"  wrote in message news:2017121312512025146-email@nowherecom...   
      
   On 2017-12-13 05:23:32 +0000, JimD said:   
      
   > Another point that came up in the IEM videos and the ones on how to use   
   > the new mixer. It is for the last 20 years or so, people have been   
   > conditioned to hear very very compressed music.  The stuff on the radio   
   > and net has had its dynamic range squished as narrow as current technology   
   > will allow.   
      
   > Maybe that's what's behind the complaints I get about our live mix ?   
      
   It's precisely that. They've been Conditioned, Brainwashed, and Programmed   
   to want to merely *hear* but NOT to Listen, which is a MENTAL ACTIVITY, and   
   reducing, if not Eliminating mental activity is Primary Objective of the   
   Dumbing-Down Program!   
   It's accomplished by LIMITING stimuli/sensory input while constantly   
   REDUCING it!   
      
   That's why Zombie songs generally have no more than four chords, and usually   
   only three...because this further promotes NON-Thinking, and compressing,   
   i.e. Reducing Amplitude Modulation i.e volume dynamics is a very Powerful   
   TACTIC, as is Reducing Frequency Modulation i.e. Limiting a song's chords to   
   three or four.   
   And since the lyrics are meaningless and soulless, this eliminates any   
   Thinking about that.   
      
   > Just thinking out loud here.  But maybe that is a factor. I recall talking   
   > to singer girl about dynamics a few weeks back. She said she couldn't "   
   > hear " certain intros and some parts of some backings.  I remember   
   > thinking at the time, what am I supposed to do, crank all the quiet parts   
   > up to as loud as when our drummer is feeling his glory ?   Some songs have   
   > quiet parts. You know, acoustic guitar intros and stuff.  I ask if I   
   > should just redline everything and let the quiet parts be as loud as the   
   > loudest things we do ?   
      
   > Maybe that is what people " condiditioned " to hear over compressed music   
   > DO expect.  They didn't grow up listening to live bands, or even mastered   
   > recordings of bands. They grew up listening to cd mastered as hot as   
   > possible, and radio or mp3's of those same cds.   
      
   Actually THEY are the ones being Mastered, by those intent on producing   
   Mindless, Soulless Non-Thinking/Questioning Zombie Robot Slaves!!!   
      
   > But wait, I heard this recent complaint for band girl. She's a real   
   > musician, knows what actual live music sounds like. Yes, but she wasn't   
   > the originator. She was passing along the remoarks from some of her family   
   > ( in their 30's -ish ) who were in the audience.   
      
   The Dumbing-Down Program Escalated to running full tilt in the late '70s,   
   and by the '80s, it was in full swing, so those 30 something year-olds only   
   so many more Zombies, particularly as the Dumbing-Down Program grows ever   
   worse into the 21st Century.   
      
   > What actual live music sounds like apparently creeps them out.   
      
   > That's an important point.   
      
   They NEED to be DEPROGRAMMED!!!   
      
   > Live doesn't creep me out. It doesn't sound " wrong " to my ears because I   
   > know what live bands sound like. But apparently some people don't.  Is it   
   > possible they actually think real musicians playing real instruments   
   > should sound like a CD ( with nearly 0db of dynamic range ) ?   
      
   Live can be compressed to death too.   
      
   > I believe that is an issue.   
      
   Got to FORCE them to Think, by playing Music that Requires it, and of course   
   they'll be 'creeped' out, and probably offended too, that someone would   
   actually DARE to try to make them actually Think! But it Must be done,   
   ideally through creative means, something they wouldn't even be aware of,   
   and That's the way in ;)   
      
   > And if so, what if I use some of this new technology I have to just squash   
   > our dynamics to nothing ?   I can.   
      
   Don't do it! You'll be Fighting for their souls, and that's no time to throw   
   in the proverbial towel!   
      
   > This reminds me of something from the past. For many years I had a few   
   > friends who hated .... HATED .... H-A-T-E-D, with a red hot hate our   
   > electronic drums, and anything I did or made with them.  The arguments   
   > were things like - they don't sound " real ".  I never ever ever heard any   
   > difference.   
      
   I've never had the chance to "A/B" them to find out.   
      
   > They sound exactly like drums to my ears, and I started out as a drummer.   
   > I finally decided the complaints were about the timing of midi tracks, or   
   > maybe they just didn't like the style of playing I used to make a lot of   
   > my stuff by.  I'm a guitar player singer now, I don't want my backings to   
   > sound like some half drunk rocker soloing on the drums thru all my songs.   
      
   Poor quality players are as common to every genre as Dumbing-Down it...and   
   there's probably a correlation in that too.   
      
   > How does this drum thing connect to the current balance issues ?   Only in   
   > that I completely don't see the problem.  I didn't see a problem with midi   
   > drums, and I don't see a problem with the quiet part of some song being a   
   > few db down, level wise.   
      
   Could  be that the commonality is one of dynamics - decompressing enhances   
   volume dynamics and I'm sure genuinely acoustic drums are capable of   
   dynamics that electronic/digital ones are not...and that goes for keyboards   
   too.   
      
   > So here I am again, trying to " fix " something I don't see anything at   
   > all worong with.   
      
   It's  Imperative to First Identify a Problem before proceeding to Fix it!   
      
   > Bands are a pain. When I'm solo, I don't hear about these issues. Hey,   
   > that's another point. The complaints come from other musicians, never from   
   > the audience or the people who hire me.  That ought to be a clue.   
      
      
   Jim   
      
   It's a very simple clue - musicians are usually far more  sensitive to sonic   
   factors than non-musicians are. I recall a statement on a 'news' program   
   that mentioned that musicians are the best candidates for learning a foreign   
   language and speaking it without an accent.   
      
   Ouisie   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)