From: oldwifetale@yahoo.com   
      
   > >> >                                      There are resources,   
   > >> > and there are human beings, and there is everything   
   > >> > in between.   
   > >>    
   > >> Noticing that is a good start indeed. Divide resources   
   > >> by humans, and you have the answer already.   
   > >   
   > > Well, you titled this thread "...the old way..." and although that   
   > > *seems* like a suitable subject for alt.native (maybe),   
   >    
   > It may or may not be suitable, that is correct. However there is no   
   > other way to reach native American tribes. You also notice that we are   
   > in the alt hierarchy of Usenet, which is meant to be open and unmoderated.   
   > It is typically a subset of Usenet where everything goes, total freedom.   
   > This may or may not be to the liking of some native Americans, however   
   > if they want a more restricted group, then soc.culture.native is more   
   > appropriate, and probably easily enough created (if it doesn't exist   
   > already). It is also possible to make such a group moderated. Usenet   
   > itself is obviously not something traditionally native American. I don't   
   > think it is wrong to use alt.native as a means to communicate with the   
   > American native tribes, about subjects that are relevant to them and   
   > us. In this case: I see such radical ignorance in the white man culture,   
   > that there is almost nobody to turn to in the whole world who even has   
   > a normal intelligence to speak with them. It is depressing to speak   
   > with just about all white men. A normal conversation is virtually impossible;   
   > I cannot recall having had once a normal conversation with even one member   
   > of the white tribes about these topics. They - the white man, nor any   
   > other - listen to me even enough to have a conversation.   
   >    
   > However some white people are generally interested   
   > ... in native-American culture ... [sorry, re-editing this sentence too   
   > often made it unreadable]   
      
   I'm starting to like you. Or maybe it's because i'm a little drunk on wine   
   right now. I don't usually drink, but... i'm not usually in this position.   
      
   Somewhere in this thread i was talking about seven generations and i listed   
   seven generations in my family (paternal line). I'm the seventh from Michael   
   who married a daughter of a woman named Blue Sky who was the daughter of a guy   
   named Chief Cornstalk.    
   Yada yada. My family has been here for a few centuries, the roots go   
   everywhere. I think some people are 'interested' in Native American culture,   
   whereas some are... (somethin'-somethin') magnetically attracted because of   
   some deeper thing none of us    
   really understand, but might have something to do with blood memories. Hard to   
   say.    
      
      
   >                                                     even if this is   
   > vague and tends to lack teeth, maybe these people would listen to a   
   > project that is economically and Governmentally more sound than failed   
   > western capitalism/socialism/anarchy/whatever-have-you, if some native   
   > Indians told them that land-distribution to all could be an interesting   
   > project for them to think about. Under the right circumstances of mass   
   > collapse of western society, by greed or war or both (which is starting   
   > to occur, again), there is a chance some would listen; some Europeans   
   > that is. I don't think the native Indians need help, they're smart enough.   
   > The Europeans are the ones who need help, they are the primitives. Which   
   > is funny in a way, because Europeans think of themselves as advanced;   
   > but that is only by building all these toys, the toys that will destroy   
   > them in the end (like nukes, gasoline, and the rest of it).   
      
   It's hard for me to be that judgmental of any one nation or 'race'. Everyone   
   has their upside and their downside. Honestly i still see a lot of good in   
   most people. And... Is ingenuity really that crippling, or is it how ingenuity   
   is used by those in    
   power? Nuclear power, by itself, isn't necessarily a bad thing. Using gasoline   
   isn't either. But when there are reserves of oil... and they're meaningless   
   because of greed, so that drilling and 'fracking' goes on beyond any measure   
   of common sense in    
   terms of the future or the well being of the planet... I don't know... It   
   seems like too many people want to go to one extreme or the other without   
   finding a healthy balance or middle ground, even when both extremes lead to   
   harsh consequences.   
      
      
   >    
   > >                                                         i'm not sure if   
   > > your "new way" is really the "old way" like you say, or even what the   
   > > old way is.   
   >    
   > That is a good subject in itself. The reason I called it the old way,   
   > is because in the old days it tended to be possible to access raw nature,   
   > casually, without interference, to work and make a living. Certainly   
   > within the tribal areas of your own nation, this tended to be possible.   
   > You might realize that we where still small settled villages ourselves,   
   > living on mounds that occaisionally got surrounded by high water, in   
   > the year 800 and following. We are not ancient Egypt here, where they   
   > have thousands of years of Empire behind them. Then we got attacked by   
   > the Vikings from the North, and the Empire of Jesusfans and their beer   
   > monks invaded from the south.    
      
   I once had a dream of one of my ancestors who was a beer monk, lol, i kid you   
   not. At the time i had no idea such 'monks' ever existed.   
      
      
   > This led to the middle ages, a horrible   
   > time indeed. In 1566 there begins Revolutions against the Jesusfans   
   > madness, and at the same time the native indians are being invaded.   
      
   I love Jesus. That's still possibly although i don't support a lot of (and   
   even most) things that have been done in the name of Jesus. That's one reason   
   i refuse to join any church. Just because many Christians (flawed humans like   
   everyone else)have    
   screwed up doesn't necessarily mean there's nothing to it.   
      
      
   > So you see that this invasion of Empire is almost one stream of events,   
   > that includes Europe's North, and then moves over the Atlantic and    
   > destroys the native Indians there as well. The middle ages and the    
   > Jesusfans, the Roman Empire, all that madness, has been such a deep   
   > shock to us all, that we do not even remember the time that came before   
   > that. World war 2 was a shock as well, but nothing compares to the shock   
   > of the middle ages, and how it ended in the Black Death.   
   >    
   > By the way, if you looked at it technically: I am native to the Netherlands.   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)