XPost: comp.sys.mac.system, alt.comp.os.windows-10, comp.mobile.android   
   From: marion@facts.com   
      
   On Fri, 11 Apr 2025 09:36:39 +0200, Arno Welzel wrote :   
      
      
   >> The original question was what was *different* & whether it was good or   
   >> bad, where what's different with iOS is Apple locks every installer to you.   
   >   
   > Yes - and?   
   >   
   > If you can not copy installer files anyway, what's the matter then if   
   > they get bound to a specific AppleID?   
      
   You bring up a logical assessment which I appreciate that you explained.   
   Since I'm always sensible and logical, I fully agree with your point.   
      
   Given Apple *already* prevents you from ever backing up any iOS installer,   
   your point is that it's immaterial that Apple *also* locks it to your ID.   
      
   (See caveat in the sig.)   
      
   However, it still matters that Apple tracks you by that unique insertion.   
      
   >> If you happen to have installed on your Android the last known good version   
   >> of any given app, you can re-install that app on *billions* of Androids.   
   >   
   > Yes, *if* you have the APK files.   
      
   Again I appreciate that you explain details that both of us are aware of,   
   but which the vast majority of people out there probably do not know.   
      
   We both agree that Google began requiring all new apps to be published   
   using the Android App Bundle (AAB) format on August 1, 2021.   
      
   Luckily, all my last known good versions date from well before then.   
   But to your point, if my last known good version dates from *after* that   
   period, and if I received my app from the Google Play Store repository,   
   then (and only then) would the base APK that is always stored on Android,   
   not be able to be put onto every Android device on the planet.   
      
   For example a base APK on my Samsung Galaxy (if downloaded after August   
   2021) would likely only work on hardware/software compatible devices.   
      
   > Google Play itself does not provide   
   > the option to install older versions - you can only download the latest   
   > version of an app which available for your device.   
      
   You are correct that Google Play doesn't allow the option of installing   
   older versions, but when you use the Google Play Store open source   
   replacement apps, they automatically save *every* version you installed.   
    Save all APKs during install   
      
   The ironic thing is that Google Play could do it too, if it wanted to,   
   since all the Google Play replacement app is doing is NOT DELETING it.   
     APKs autosaved to sdcard   
      
   This is why I have *thousands* of APKs stored automatically on Windows.   
     Aurora saves all APKs   
      
   > And if your device is   
   > too old some apps may even not be available any longer, because the   
   > publishers decided not to support older Android versions etc.   
      
   While I agree with you, that's why you autosave every APK you install!   
      
   You can grab them and just slide them over to the phone to install them!   
      Drag APK from Windows   
      
   >> The point not being the sheer number but the fact it's unrestricted re-use.   
   >> However... that same scenario won't work for iOS owners. And that's bad.   
   >   
   > For iOS owners many other things don't work the same way.   
   > If you don't like that, just don't use it. Problem solved.   
      
   I must disagree with your attitude that you feel there's no reason to   
   understand anything that you simply happen to not like how it works.   
      
   The fact is we're discussing HOW things work & what's good/bad about it.   
   I didn't start this thread topic. I am merely answering the question asked.   
      
   Your admonition that if you don't like something, then you have no right to   
   explain how that something works, is not an attitude that I share with you.   
      
   >> Even an iTunes "backup" of that last known good version of an app does not   
   >> contain a re-usable IPA to that last known good version of that iOS app.   
   >   
   > Yes, the same as in Android. Android backups do not backup everything   
   > and apps installer files will not be backed up at all, just the list   
   > which app should be installed.   
      
   While I understand what you claimed, most people will believe your words as   
   stated to mean more than what you meant them to mean, so that's a problem.   
      
   The fact is Android already automatically saves every APK you install.   
   That base.apk is *always* there. All you have to do is copy it to the PC.   
      
    @echo off   
    echo Getting list of installed packages...   
    adb shell pm list packages -f > packages.txt   
    echo Extracting APK paths and pulling files...   
    for /F "tokens=1* delims=:" %%A in ('type packages.txt') DO (   
        if "%%A"=="package" (   
            for /F "tokens=1 delims== " %%C in ("%%B") DO (   
                echo Pulling "%%C"   
                adb pull "%%C" "Pulled_APKs\"   
            )   
        )   
    )   
    echo Done. APKs have been pulled to the "Pulled_APKs" folder.   
    del packages.txt   
    pause   
      
   But what you're saying is that the user has to think to do that.   
   And I agree with that sentiment. Backup strategies have to be planned.   
      
   >> The app backup only contains garbage such as meta data & app data.   
   >> But the app backup (even with iTunes) does NOT contain the full ipa file.   
   >   
   > The same applies to Android.   
      
   That statement is not correct since the Android base apk is always there.   
   There are *plenty* of APK extractors on Android which back up the APKs.   
      
   Here's one from my own notes when I used to extract all the Android APKs.   
    ML Manager: APK Extractor Javier Santos V   
    4.0 star 3.35K reviews 500K+ Downloads   
       
       
       
    Files stored by default in internal   
    MLManager: Settings > Custom folder for extracted APKs   
    Default: /storage/emulated/0/Android/media/com.javiersantos.mlmanager   
    It doesn't seem to be able to put them on the sdcard automatically.   
    Custom: /storage/0000-0001/0001/apk/mlmanager <== does not work   
    Custom: /storage/emulated/0/0000/apk/mlmanager <== works   
      
   >> Every other operating system allows the user to re-install the last known   
   >> good version after a factory reset (or crash, or whatever)... except Apple.   
   >   
   > Nope. Android does not allow to do this either if you do not manually   
   > extract APK files. And even then you can not be sure of the APK file   
   > works on another device because the publisher uses AAB for publishing.   
      
   We agree that the average user doesn't know what we know so that average   
   user might not know how to easily back up all the Android APKs like we do.   
      
   But that doesn't change the facts as presented in this thread that with   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-DOS v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)