From: david@edenroad.demon.co.uk   
      
   On Fri, 03 Jun 2005 15:00:21 +0000, TOAD wrote:   
      
   > David Mitchell wrote:   
   >> On Fri, 03 Jun 2005 12:32:52 +0000, TOAD wrote:   
   >>   
   >>   
   >>>¡E¡¡E«¢¥À¤Ó­¦@²Á²Á wrote:   
   >>>   
   >>>>what is the difference between OBE and remote viewing???   
   >>>>   
   >>>>   
   >>>>   
   >>>I believe that I have experienced remote viewing, and Grant's   
   >>>description fits my experiences very well.   
   >>>   
   >>>Some of my best remote viewing experiences have occurred while I have   
   >>>been lying down, relaxing.  Without falling asleep or going into any   
   >>>meditation routines, I have at times been able to see very detailed   
   >>>images which I believe fall within the category of 'remote viewing'.   
   >>   
   >>   
   >> Why do you not think that they are just ordinary hypnogogic images?   
   >>   
   >>   
   > Hi David,   
   >   
   > That is an excellent point.  The reason I believe that the images are not   
   > ordinary hypnogogic images is because I am still aware of my physical,   
   > external surroundings.  Noises - people coming & going, and so forth.   
      
   Although hypnogogic imagery is usually associated with introverted states   
   during which the RAS is preventing perception of external sensory   
   information, it's not always.   
      
   Janice, for example, has "projected" her imagery into the external   
   world (by having one eye closed, and the other open).   
      
   I've been working with binaural beat software to improve my imagery, and   
   I've found that sometimes I can get very vivid images whilst still being   
   aware of sound.   
      
   > Another notable point is that some of the images have taken me by surprise   
   > - they have seemed totally 'alien' - as though not akin to my psyche   
   > - rather like watching through the eyes of another.  I suppose, in   
   > essence, that I am talking about a gut-feeling here.   
      
   You'd be amazed what turns up - faces you don't know, places you don't   
   recognise, I'm not sure "alienness" counts for too much. ;-)   
      
   >   
   > The images are *SO* detailed, and they are persistent ('unaided') and are   
   > of their own volition.  Although, if I try to focus-in too closely upon a   
   > single, detailed point, then the image(s) presented change (reminds me of   
   > the conscious waking-up to the doings of the subconscious!).   
      
   I have similar problems, although mine just tend to disappear very quickly   
   if I focus too intently on them.   
      
   > I suppose there is no true test or way of knowing for sure.  But I have   
   > had a fairly peppered-experience of such states, and these particular   
   > experiences seem to fall into a category of their own.  'Remote viewing'   
   > fulfils the title of that category rather well.   
      
   What you need is a test ;-)   
      
   Have a friend give you a dozen map coordinates, write a description of   
   what you see for each one and get a third party to match them to your   
   friends descriptions of what's at each one (from the map).   
      
   > Smile at the Sun,   
      
   Aaargh, my eyes!   
      
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   = David    --- If you use Microsoft products, you will, inevitably, get   
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