From: kiwi@ing.notin.aus   
      
   In article ,   
   david@edenroad.demon.co.uk says...   
   >   
   >On Sun, 05 Jun 2005 22:30:01 +0000, Your Name Here=Harvey wrote:   
   >   
   >> Logic - why land on the white house lawn, on a monument to a corrupted   
   >> government who only makes the world troublespots worse than what they are.   
   >> This world is 'mad' - turn on the news, read the media, etc.   
   >> All western civilisation has done is to corrupt the native peoples and   
   >> decimate them in one way or another, disrupting their society entirely.   
   >> So why should any advanced alien civilisation wish contact with us?   
   >> We have little to offer them, except madness and corruptness.   
   >   
   >I know it's impossible to second guess the motives of another species; but   
   >that doesn't make sense on any level.   
   >Either they're making contact, or they aren't.  Either they write "Hello   
   >World" on the moon in 8 mile high letters, or they keep their little grey   
   >heads down.   
   >They don't abduct people and stuck probes in their butts (what, can't they   
   >get porn on their planet or something?), and they don't find isolated   
   >individuals with personality issues and credibility problems and pretend   
   >to reveal the secrets of the universe to them.   
      
   UFOs and ETs have been noted for several types of encounters.   
      
   1. They enter the atmosphere, and a few may have eye contact with a human   
      being, seen to get some supplies (water?) and leave.   
      One spoke to lady, and gave her a 'biscuit' and left.   
      
   2. The other type is that of abduction. Usually this is buried in the   
      subjects' memory and comes out later. eg. The Betty and Barney Hill case,   
      Travis Walton case, etc.   
      
   3. The communication encounter, in which intelligent conversation is   
      carried out. This is very rare - eg. Billy Meier, there are supposedly   
      other similar ones, which the Plejarens have confirmed are real encounters.   
      
   4. Now there are some encounters, which are not 'alien' UFOs but are of   
      terrestrial (earth built) UFOs - and they want to give the appearance   
      that they are 'alien' from offworld.   
      There may be abductions made, to give the appearance that they were   
      abducted by aliens.   
      This is to give the illusion that all ETs and aliens are 'bad' and are   
      up to no good.   
      
   >   
   >>   
   >> Trillions of miles of space? Means nothing to ETs who have the capability   
   >> to traverse that amount of space.   
   >   
   >You're forgetting the fact that space is 3-D.   
   >"Trillions of miles" of distance, is trillions of trillions of trillions   
   >of cubic miles, in which to find one small blue planet.   
   >   
   >> You're thinking the mind of a limited   
   >> human, who believes that the speed of light limits space travel, that   
   >> UFOs cannot possibly exist because that space travel cannot be faster   
   >> than the speed of light, etc.   
   >   
   >You're thinking with the mind of someone who knows nothing about physics.   
   >As far as we know, FTL travel is impossible - it violates relativity; and   
   >while I'm happy to admit that GR could be incomplete, I'd want much better   
   >evidence than "FTL travel must be possible because sometimes I can't   
   >identify things I see in the sky".   
      
   1000 years ago, if you talked about flying through the air vertically and   
   horizontally, and going much much faster than a horse, you would be thought   
   of, as being quite made.   
   1000 years in the future - Faster than light travel may be just like getting   
   onto an airliner today?   
      
   >   
   >> And that 'earth' is rare, as far inhabitable planets goes, etc. That humans   
   >> are rare.   
      
   The Plejarens say that when a planet has the ideal conditions for life,   
   humans naturally evolve on that planet - so that humans on planets is not   
   a rare event, but a natural one. Also they say that many more planets have   
   been colonised by galactic travellers. They actually give figures, but I   
   don't have that information handy at the moment.   
   The history of the Earth according to the Plejarens are given at   
   wwww.semjase.net   
   The humans of this planet has interbred with ETs at several times in our   
   history.   
   I tend to agree with these ideas - they seem plausible enough, given the   
   age of the Earth and what we have here, now. There are all sorts of mysteries   
   yet to be explained adequately here.   
      
   >   
   >We know, roughly, what proportion of stars can have planets like ours,   
   >comparatively speaking, they _are_ rare, and shortlived.   
   >   
   >> Hmmm random nutter?   
   >> Exactly the sort of comments expected, when someone who genuinely presents   
   >> a UFO story to the public, gets labelled with.   
   >> You don't bother to read all the material available about Billy Meier -   
   >> there are negative criticisms, and positive ones. You seem to biased   
   heavily   
   >> to the negative views without acknowledging the other side.   
   >   
   >Positive criticism?   
   >Not sure what you mean by that; but I have looked at the material Meier   
   >publishes as being records of his communication with his space buddies,   
   >and it's nonsense.   
   >As are his "prophecies".   
      
   There are experts who validate the Meier evidence, and experts who   
   disagree. Who are to be believed?   
      
   >   
   >> I am aware of both sides, but not with all the details of the negative   
   >> criticisms - the ones you've mentioned are not valid,   
   >   
   >So, we've got: obvious fakes, use of models, use of camera trickery,   
   >presenting sears catalogue photo's as real, presenting a painting of an   
   >earthquake as a real event.   
      
   I know of other photographs which are just as hard to believe,   
   that you have not mentioned, but I haven't heard much about that   
   earthquake one.   
      
   >   
   >And none of these are valid?   
   >What does he have to do, actually fake up a photo in front of you?   
   >   
   >> nor have I heard/read of them being valid.   
   >   
   >I doubt very much whether you've tried.   
   >You claim to want to use logic, go ahead.   
   >If the above claims are real, then Meier is a fraud.   
   >If you want to know whether he's a fraud, investigate those claims.   
   >   
   >If you won't, why not?   
   >   
   >> Your claims don't fit the evidence.   
   >   
   >You haven't checked, by your own admission.   
   >   
   >> I know that Billy Meier's wife was disgruntled and disappointed with him,   
   >> and she was certainly fed up with all the publicity etc. So in leaving him,   
   >> she may have said some things she regrets saying now?   
   >   
   >Pathetic.   
   >   
   >> Billy Meier says many, many, many things which sounds like science fiction   
   >   
   >   
   >   
   >> us evolve by our own impetus and thinking.   
   >   
   >>>What does logic tell you now?   
   >>   
   >> Logic tells me you are not impartial nor willing to look at both sides   
   >> fairly and intelligently, that you do not know about the technical   
   information   
   >> and details regarding faking photographs, especially of the early 80s'.   
   >   
   >Oddly enough, that's when I got my photography O-level a year early (a   
   >minor qualification in the UK school system).   
   >   
   >> Taking photographs of models suspended by string (or fishing line, etc) or   
   on   
      
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