XPost: sci.skeptic, alt.atheism, sci.logic   
   XPost: alt.politics.usa   
   From: jtem01@gmail.com   
      
   On 7/21/25 9:39 PM, JTEM wrote:   
   >   
   > This has been big recently so I'm going to jump on   
   > the bandwagon -- "Back" on the bandwagon, I suppose,   
   > as I had already been on it -- and add my 2 cents.   
   >   
   > Or re-add it....   
   >   
   > https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/37931631449   
   >   
   > https://jtem.tumblr.com/post/7738633982   
      
   So this is from a 2016 exchange I had on the topic.   
      
   I do wrong here. I spend more time dwelling on   
   motives instead of on facts.   
      
   This is what normally puts the "Kooky" into "Kooky   
   Conspiracy Theories."   
      
   People notice a problem with a claim, debunk that   
   claim and that's fine. But then they dream up all   
   sorts of "Theories" as alternative explanations and   
   if anyone can find a whole in them, or just junk   
   they sound a little off, they'll cling to the official   
   version you just debunked.   
      
   "Okay, so the Warren Commission is wrong, but you said   
   the mafia did it so I'm going to forget how you   
   debunked the Warren Commission and go back to believing   
   it."   
      
   So, with that in mind...   
      
   You've run straight into the problem of contamination.   
      
   See, in history, what is often the case is a great deal   
   is said & done AFTER the fact. Take the great fire   
   of London, for example. Did you know that for a great   
   many years it was attributed to Catholics in precisely   
   the same manner that the great fire of Rome was   
   blamed on Christians? But between then & now that   
   little element got "Cleaned up," so when modern   
   people attribute thoughts & motives to those who   
   were contemporaries to the fire, we never attribute   
   the conspiracies to them... even though most believed   
   them.   
      
   Okay, so you're doing that now with the Hitler thing.   
      
   The official version, the British version, the "World   
   at War" version of Hitler's death is about all you'll   
   ever read today. But it was by no means the first   
   version. Nor was it a particularly popular one even   
   a few decades ago.   
      
   The first published reports claimed that Hitler died   
   in a field hospital in Berlin!   
      
   Oh. And even the "World at War" version, which is   
   now the official version, is highly inconsistent. Take   
   Hitler's secretary that you raised. Her account   
   differs greatly from pretty much all others in that   
   Eva Braun wasn't even in the room with Hitler when   
   he died!  And she heard the loud "Pop" of the gun,   
   while Hitler's body guard said there was no sound.   
      
   AND THEIR STORIES CHANGED!   
      
   Also, the arrows keep suspiciously pointing back   
   to the British!  The story of Hitler's marriage, for   
   example, originates with the British, not the   
   Soviets who captured the bunker and everybody   
   in it, and not the survivors. The British "Recovered"   
   the marriage records soon after the war and far   
   away from the Bunker... exactly where they weren't   
   supposed to be.   
      
   My personal theory, which I don't think we should   
   raise, is that pretending Hitler died much later than   
   he did served a lot of agendas, though it was put   
   into place by the British.   
      
   See, the Germans wanted to drag out the war,   
   because they needed the time to move their   
   troops west so they could surrender to the   
   Americans. The Russians were brutal, and pretty   
   much every German prisoner of war (plus loads   
   of non-soldiers) were condemned to Soviet   
   slave labor for a period of YEARS.   
      
   So the Germans were highly motivated to keep   
   the war going, to pretend Hitler was alive.   
      
   It's no secret that the British were already fighting   
   WWIII long before the end of WWII. Churchill's   
   insane invasion of Greece was supposed to   
   advance up into eastern Europe, snatching it   
   out of Soviet hands.   
      
   Before WWII ended the allies settled on zones   
   of operations -- sectors. Just as Berlin was   
   divided between all the allies, Nazi controlled   
   Europe was as well. This was absolutely necessary   
   in order to keep the allied armies from attacking   
   each other...   
      
   "Friendly Fire."   
      
   It was also politically necessary. If we were   
   responsible for a sector then the Soviets couldn't   
   accuse us of allowing them to take heavy losses   
   by not entering a different sector...   
      
   Okay, so as the war was ending the allies in the   
   west, particularly the Americans, were doing WAY   
   better than originally anticipated. Quite frankly, we   
   were gobbling up territory that we had agreed to   
   leave to the Soviets. And we were looting all the   
   technology AND SCIENTISTS we could find! So   
   America had a lot of incentive to go along with any   
   Let's-Postpone-Hitler's-Death scheme. The longer   
   the war dragged out, the more territory we   
   gobbled up, the more high technology & scientists   
   we got (and the Russians didn't).   
      
   And, of course, the British were the ones who were   
   always fighting WWIII in the first place. They needed   
   Hitler to not be dead YET because they didn't want   
   to just gobble up territory assigned to the Soviets,   
   they wanted to keep it!  They wanted to keep the   
   Russians out!   
      
   Only Stalin lacked any real incentive to play along.   
   But, the Russian troops did!  They had no choice.   
   Disappointing Stalin was a death sentence, and   
   Stalin wanted Hitler. So the Russian troops had   
   every incentive to "Find" Hitler no matter what. And   
   if their lives were on the line, the lives of their   
   German prisoners were on the line as well!   
      
   The Russian autopsy report wasn't published until   
   1968!  And when it was it mirrored the myths!   
      
   It's no secret that the autopsy of Hitler claimed he   
   had only one testicle. But this was no revelation!   
   British propaganda had been making that claim   
   going back to the earliest years of the war! So   
   the 1968 autopsy report was telling people what   
   they already believed. It wasn't revealing anything   
   new...   
      
   And the Russians took a ridiculous number of   
   photos of Goebbles and his family! They even   
   shot movie footage! So there's photos of them   
   as found, movie footage of them as found and   
   even autopsy photos of all of them. But none of   
   Hitler!   
      
   The only human remains ever identified as Hitler's   
   turned out to belong to a woman. And as it   
   supposedly "Proved" a gunshot wound, it completely   
   contradicts all accounts of Hitler's death, as Eva   
   Braun was never supposed to have been shot!   
      
      
   --   
   https://jtem.tumblr.com/tagged/The%20Book%20of%20JTEM/page/5   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)