[continued from previous message]   
      
   > > > > > > > > > > > independent sources if, in fact, it had happened.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > It was. It is mentioned by others in the NT. Most notable   
   John,   
   > > > > > > > > > > Matthew   
   > > > > > > > > > > Luke,   
   > > > > > > > > > > Mark.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Paul was not an eyewitness of Jesus at that time. Paul saw   
   him for   
   > > > > > > > > > > the   
   > > > > > > > > > > first   
   > > > > > > > > > > time on the road to Damascus   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > 1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which   
   I also   
   > > > > > > > > > > received,   
   > > > > > > > > > > how that Christ died for our sins according to the   
   scriptures;   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > 1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again   
   the third   
   > > > > > > > > > > day   
   > > > > > > > > > > according to the scriptures:   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > 1Co 15:5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the   
   twelve:   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > 1Co 15:6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred   
   brethren at   
   > > > > > > > > > > once;   
   > > > > > > > > > > of   
   > > > > > > > > > > whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some   
   are fallen   
   > > > > > > > > > > asleep.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > 1Co 15:7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the   
   apostles.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > 1Co 15:8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one   
   born out   
   > > > > > > > > > > of   
   > > > > > > > > > > due   
   > > > > > > > > > > time.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Jesus then taught Paul in the desert for during a time of   
   three   
   > > > > > > > > > > years.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Gal 1:11 But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel   
   which was   
   > > > > > > > > > > preached   
   > > > > > > > > > > of   
   > > > > > > > > > > me is not after man.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Gal 1:12 For I neither received it of man, neither was I   
   taughtit,   
   > > > > > > > > > > but   
   > > > > > > > > > > by   
   > > > > > > > > > > the   
   > > > > > > > > > > revelation of Jesus Christ.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Gal 1:13 For ye have heard of my conversation in time past   
   in the   
   > > > > > > > > > > Jews'   
   > > > > > > > > > > religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church   
   of God,   
   > > > > > > > > > > and   
   > > > > > > > > > > wasted   
   > > > > > > > > > > it:   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > ***   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Gal 1:17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were   
   apostles   
   > > > > > > > > > > before   
   > > > > > > > > > > me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto   
   Damascus.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Gal 1:18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to   
   see Peter,   
   > > > > > > > > > > and   
   > > > > > > > > > > abode with him fifteen days.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Gal 1:19 But other of the apostles saw I none, save James   
   the Lord's   
   > > > > > > > > > > brother.   
   > > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > > Gal 1:20 Now the things which I write unto you, behold,   
   before God,   
   > > > > > > > > > > I   
   > > > > > > > > > > lie   
   > > > > > > > > > > not.   
   > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > This was an interesting read. At first I thought you were   
   writing a   
   > > > > > > > > synopsis   
   > > > > > > > > of one of his writings, but such does not appear to be the   
   case. I   
   > > > > > > > > have   
   > > > > > > > > not   
   > > > > > > > > studied his works, but I briefly reviewed some of the comments   
   made by   
   > > > > > > > > others   
   > > > > > > > > who have their own views of what he wrote. Sadly it is   
   difficult to   
   > > > > > > > > comment   
   > > > > > > > > on them since I would have to study up on Paine in order to   
   know   
   > > > > > > > > something   
   > > > > > > > > about him, and it would have to be mainly the things written   
   by his   
   > > > > > > > > hand,   
   > > > > > > > > not   
   > > > > > > > > based on the comments of others, unless they were peer friends   
   of his,   
   > > > > > > > > personally.   
   > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > What little I read this morning, was a whole lot of things   
   supposedly   
   > > > > > > > > of   
   > > > > > > > > what   
   > > > > > > > > he said and thought, but it was clear that people cherry picked   
   > > > > > > > > phrases   
   > > > > > > > > that   
   > > > > > > > > lent themselves to support their personal agendas. According   
   to what   
   > > > > > > > > you   
   > > > > > > > > outlined it would seem that Paine had at best a shallow and   
   limited   
   > > > > > > > > understanding of the Bible, and virtually no personal   
   knowledge of   
   > > > > > > > > God.   
   > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > I will make a brief comment to each numeric point. LOL,   
   hopefully   
   > > > > > > > > brief.   
   > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > An interesting contradiction occurs with Paul's testimony,   
   which was   
   > > > > > > > > > pointed out by Thomas Paine, one of America's founding   
   fathers. Here   
   > > > > > > > > > it   
   > > > > > > > > > is in outline form:   
   > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > 1) Paul, while being a Jew, claims to have persecuted   
   Christians, a   
   > > > > > > > > > claim also made about him by the author of Acts.   
   > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > This point shows and gives an understanding of how little   
   attention he   
   > > > > > > > > paid   
   > > > > > > > > to the NT.   
   > > > > > > > > It is obvious that he was a chief persecutor and he explained   
   why.   
   > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > 2) When someone persecutes another, especially, a strange,   
   it is   
   > > > > > > > > > because you do not like what that person has done, is   
   saying, and/or   
   > > > > > > > > > certain viewpoints that they, as a group, hold to. (As an   
   example, it   
   > > > > > > > > > is possible for a Jew and a Muslim to hate each other even   
   though   
   > > > > > > > > > they   
   > > > > > > > > > have never met.)   
   > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > That would describe his agenda for those he persecuted. He   
   took the   
   > > > > > > > > attitude   
   > > > > > > > > of a Muslim towards the destruction of all those who opposed   
   his   
   > > > > > > > > religious   
   > > > > > > > > mindset, under the authority of the High Priest of his day.   
   > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > > 3) As such, Paul, prior to his conversion to Christianity,   
   must have   
   > > > > > > > > > head the accounts of Jesus of Nazareth rising from the dead,   
   which   
   > > > > > > > > > must   
   > > > > > > > > > have included the so-called appearances of Jesus to the "five   
   > > > > > > > > > hundred".   
   > > > > > > > > > In spite of hearing those accounts, Paul continued to   
   persecute   
   > > > > > > > > > Christians; as such, Paul himself did not find the accounts   
   of Jesus   
   > > > > > > > > > being raised from the dead by God as being convincing.   
   > > > > > > > >   
   > > > > > > > > He may have heard, and was aware of the reports. Especially   
   because he   
   > > > > > > > > was   
   > > > > > > > > chief amongst the Pharisees. Like the typical atheist of   
   today, they   
   > > > > > > > > hear   
   > > > > > > > > much and deny all, and this was also the mindset of the Jews   
   who   
   > > > > > > > > persecuted   
   > > > > > > > > their brother Jew who believed in Christ. To them it was   
   heresy. Yet   
   > > > > > > > > the   
   > > > > > > > > OT   
   > > > > > > > > spoke of the Messiah that was to come, when, and where, and   
   what he   
   > > > > > > > > would   
   > > > > > > > > do.   
   > > > > > > > > They had an idea that he was to come and set them up as a   
   ruling   
   > > > > > > > > Nation   
   > > > > > > > > over   
   > > > > > > > > all other nations. And that will happen in the future, but   
   many looked   
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)