From: banerjeeadda1234@gmail.com   
      
   On Friday, 18 August 2023 at 04:48:23 UTC+10, tooly wrote:   
   > There is an obvious widening disconnect going on between the right and left,   
   to the point now, when one side gains power, the other side 'feels' oppressed.   
   Both sides use the word 'fascist' now, to describe the leanings of either,   
   inculcating both    
   Hitlerian and Bolshevik marxism imagery as descriptors either would use to   
   describe the other.    
   >    
   > Something is going on. I think we all 'FEEL" it. Our spidey senses [as it   
   were] are 'tingling' that something is in the air; a change; a chasm   
   where...well, the side that 'wins' out at the cultural level, will most likely   
   annihilate the other. It may    
   even descend into far more dangerous violence and conflict [we all hope that   
   doesn't happen]. War is a terrible thing, but Civil War a far worse chaos,   
   where the enemy is unseen, living among you...and no one really knows who to   
   fight [at least in early    
   stages]; as like in the Soviet Revolution circa 1918, staying neutral was   
   often a death sentence if the wrong army showed up on any given day [and there   
   were several armied factions]. Civil wars are terrifying times when every   
   woman, child, and man exist    
   on the battlefield [sic].    
   >    
   > In trying to understand the root of this NEW discord, mainly in the west,   
   many analysts point to things like Identity politics [on the left], Populism   
   and nationalism [on the right], and a growing 'progressivism' [so called]   
   that, in it's march to    
   demand inclusion to the nth degree, threatens overturn of many [if not all]   
   old world traditions, mores, and even morals...as being products of systemic   
   racism or masculine patriarchy...and a general 're-education' of the citizenry   
   into the Marxist    
   approach to life as being totally and forever...a STRUGGLE of the OPPRESSED vs   
   the OPPRESSORS.    
   >    
   > Each 'Identified' group under this new world 'perception' of ourselves, have   
   their own agenda for self aggrandizement and come uppence, but all come   
   together as a general army [on the LEFT] to 'tear' down the structures that   
   now exist, to erect...well,    
   each group probably has their own idea, their own agenda on what exactly 'to   
   erect'. And under the Marxist model, the struggle for dominance would   
   theoretically continue [the next OPPRESSOR then becoming the gunsights of   
   everyone else, supposedly    
   oppressed].    
   >    
   > If one thinks through this new LEFTIST proposition now gaining traction in   
   the world [even again], one would think the general flaw would be apparent?   
   There is no end point! This model offers no peace, no tranquility, no   
   essential ultimate goal...but    
   ONLY struggle; ONLY war...ONLY an endless pitting of Humanity against itself;   
   one tyrant after another on into memoriam. Oppressed versus the Oppressor. A   
   story without END.    
   >    
   > While this describes well the LEFT today and their descent into IDENTITY   
   politics [as a rehash of this old critical theory of Oppressed vs   
   Oppressor]...what, other than the resistance to change, might hold the RIGHT   
   together? Is it just Sarte's 'wagon    
   wheel' ruts of our minds where we tend to follow our parents their   
   parents...creating simple traditions that were mostly stewed in the fat of   
   myth and mystery [ie without injection of science and all we now know].    
   >    
   > Or...could there be a deeper understanding of this widening gap today?    
   >    
   > FREEDOM versus EQUALITY?    
   > If one looks at the root of most of what drives the LEFT...they might find   
   at the base 'reasoning' is the idea of EQUALITY. From wealth accrual,   
   classism, racism, and gender ideology...one could argue that the real pursuit   
   of any 'identified' faction    
   is EQUALITY...simply to be accepted, known, and respected as the highest level   
   [whatever that might be]. By the nature of how western civilization was   
   created, and the cultural dominance that civilization has enjoyed, that   
   highest level [or respect and    
   acceptance] becomes...well, white males. Tearing down any barrier that   
   protects 'that' class...has become the essential agenda of the LEFT [for   
   now]...on their march. Socialism [often predicated as the TRUE objective]   
   ultimately is to tear down any    
   wealth that white males accrued in that civilization, redistributing it in   
   various fashion [breaking of glass ceilings for instance, or reparations, or   
   simply erradicating capitalism]...ergo, re-designing all things toward a more   
   equal outcome. EQUALITY..   
   .the goal.    
   >    
   > Of course, the other VALUE that seems to counter this argument is   
   FREEDOM...and was the essential founding value that America was built upon   
   [it's corner stone]. To create a new EQUAL society, force is often used   
   [especially to tear down barriers]...   
   and the obvious collision against that corner stone...FREEDOM. The RIGHT   
   essentially fights for FREEDOM [to remain as much so as possible] while on the   
   LEFT, the essential struggle is to create a more EQUITABLE society. FREEDOM vs   
   EQUALITY. It's not an    
   easy question really, as most human beings would relate heavily to either one   
   [as an iDEA, a VALUE]. We ALL want to be EQUAL [certainly no one wants to be   
   declared or FEEL as UNequal]...and we all want to also be FREE. But what do we   
   do when these values    
   CLASH; where, one must be chosen over the other? It's not an easy question;   
   and we all have trouble making the assessment...and descend on a case by case   
   basis.    
   >    
   > HOMO SAPIENS vs. HUMAN BEING    
   > Now, this argument is a harder one to make. Most of us equate the two terms   
   as synonyms...one equaling the other. But are they?    
   >    
   > Science has brought us a long way. We surely DO have domain over all other   
   creatures on this planet [for the moment anyway]. One of the mainstays of   
   science is our ability to REASON, to use LOGIC, and then to think critically.   
   This means being    
   OBJECTIVE. In fact, we differentiate the 'irrational' from the rational, and   
   science being the PRODUCT of total rationality [even to the point we often   
   disdain irrationality].    
   >    
      
   [continued in next message]   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)