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|    alt.philosophy    |    Didn't Freud have sex with his mother?    |    170,335 messages    |
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|    Message 168,998 of 170,335    |
|    Ilya Shambat to All    |
|    Feminism and traditional roles    |
|    12 Feb 24 13:18:28    |
      From: ibshambat@gmail.com              When I was 6, my mother tried to get me to wash the floor, to which I       responded, “We are not women.”              I have no idea how I got that sentiment. I certainly didn’t get it from her,       I don’t think I got it from my dad, and I know I didn’t make it up on my       own.               I am ashamed to have had that sentiment; but then I was 6. In my relationships       I did both a chunk of the traditionally male work and a chunk of the       traditionally woman work. In my relationships there were some situations in       which I was in charge; other        situations in which the woman was in charge; and other situations on equal       power. I have had woman bosses and translated woman poets. I have seen women       as being better than men since an early age. I am the last person that one       would expect to behave in a        sexist manner. If I can be vulnerable to this kind of tomfoolery, then who       isn’t?              What do I actually believe? I believe that both the misogyny and misandry are       for brats and idiots. Basically, these people don’t know how good they have       it. The misogynist is not with Andrea Dworkin. The misandrist is not with       Eminem or Mullah Omar.        Instead these people have partners who are much better people than they are       themselves, whom they then insist on treading like dirt. And that makes the       world a worse place for everyone and lets the worst people dominate the better       people, both men and        women.              Are either women or men to be hated? That is completely wrong. Both women and       men are people. People are beings capable of choice. Anything capable of       choice can be good or bad. Most people – women and men - are both.              So we have hostility between family-minded women and career-minded women. In       both situations there is potential for wrongdoing. A woman who has a family       with a man would be in a bad way if the man decides to act like a jerk. But       there are also going to        be jerks in the corporate world.               In my adult life I’ve done enough of cleaning, cooking, changing diapers and       any number of other things that are seen as being traditional women’s roles.       I’ve honored women’s authority in workplace and supported powerful women.       I took part in an        effort to fight domestic violence. I’ve had respectful, non-abusive       relationships with women close to me. Whatever influence my statement came       from, is nowhere near me any longer. That is result of both me working on       myself and making sense of my        influences – also of input from other people, both men and women.              To men who have a negative view of women, consider women who are worthy of       your respect. Consider Queen Elizabeth I, Marie Medici, Joan of Arc, Rosa       Parks, Marie Curie, Amelia Earhardt, Sandy Lerner, Jane Fonda, Oprah Winfrey,       Margaret Thatcher, Hillary        Clinton, Julia Mancuso, Sarah Hughes, Penelope Cruze, Emily Dickinson, Dorothy       Parker. That some women are evil no more means that all women are evil than is       that some men are evil means that all men are evil. Anything capable of choice       can be good. That        is the case both with women and men.              Is wiping the floor a part of a traditional female role? Such things are       something that every couple should work out for itself. I did not feel       emasculated for doing traditionally female work., nor did I try to prevail on       women I’ve been with to do        such a thing. One of the women I’ve been with was a very serious Christian,       and she was willing to do such things as part of her understanding of what is       the traditional female role, without me demanding such things of her.              That something is part of a traditional gender role does not mean that it is       superior or inferior to that of the other traditional gender role. The       traditionally female tasks should be seen as being just as important and       valuable as the traditionally        male tasks. The task that women perform that men can’t perform – bringing       into the world new life – should be uniquely valued. A priest once said in a       sermon that men and women are “same in value, different in roles.” A       feminist would look at        this and say, “What a pig.” But you cannot portray as a pig someone who       sees women as better than men and actively seeks their benefit.              I want to see women having safe life inside the home and a fulfilling life       outside the home. As for division of labor, once again I believe that this       should be up to the couple. Some women want to do such tasks; others don’t.       Some men want to do such        tasks; others don’t.               All of the above should have a right to their choices. And the world should       have a right to benefit from people pursuing that right.              --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05        * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)    |
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