From: dnomhcir@gmx.com   
      
   D  writes:   
      
   > On Sun, 16 Mar 2025, Richmond wrote:   
   >   
   >>> Have you ever calculated wrong? Or didn't think out the implications   
   >>> of your thoughts, or reached the wrong conclusion, only to realize   
   >>> later, oh, that was not right, this is the right conclusion?   
   >>   
   >> Yes, but those are mistakes, not hallucinations.   
   >   
   > I think the senses are meant by hallucinations, perhaps not the best   
   > concept to use.   
   >   
   >>>   
   >>> Examples of thinking gone wrong. Another way is if your sensory   
   >>> input is messed with, that could be by rearranged electrons in your   
   >>> brain, and since that can also be thoughts, the evil entity could   
   >>> also do that.   
   >>>   
   >>   
   >> Perhaps if I were delirious I might think things which make no sense   
   >> to my non-delirious self.   
   >   
   > You have never done that when drunk? Alcohol affects your thinking,   
   > and drugs as well, you might "hallucinate" things due to a drug, and   
   > in reality it was all in your mind.   
   >   
   >>> If the entity is the one that runs the simulation, of which your   
   >>> brain is a part, it means he can rearrange every single bit in every   
   >>> single memory cell, to make an analogy from technology.   
   >>   
   >> Doubt is a thought. So if you doubt your thoughts then you doubt that   
   >> you doubt. You really are done for, completely lost in that case.   
   >   
   > This is exactly my point. If you doubt your senses, you are doubting   
   > electrons in your brain, and you should in order to be consistent,   
   > doubt your thoughts about what you see, and as you rightly point out,   
   > you doubt your doubt, and on into solipsism it goes.   
   >   
   > That is what I mean when I say that we can be 100% of an external   
   > world, but taking our senses as proof, together with things such as   
   > the success of science.   
   >   
   > Because if you cannot trust your senses, you cannot trust your brain   
   > and your mind either. Everything collapses into doubt, and   
   > communication (and debate) becomes meaningless.   
   >   
   >> I accept though that senses are processed by the brain, so if you are   
   >> seeing things for example, it is your brain which is at fault   
   >> probably, not your eyes.   
   >   
   > Do you accept, by extension, that since the brain is at fault, for   
   > instance if you take a drug, your thoughts could also be doubted?   
      
   Yes, but in a practical sense I don't think I would doubt my   
   thoughts. For example I don't doubt my thoughts when asleep even though   
   they don't make sense when I recall them. Being able to doubt your own   
   thoughts implies they are still functioning on some level.   
      
   --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05   
    * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)